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| Namaste walkyourdreams,
Happiness is not found outside. Happiness is an inside job.
Why go to far, remote places looking for an ashram, when the "ashram" is in your heart.
Wherever you go, there you are.
Why? When people die, where will they go?
There is only this vast, beginningless, endless continuum, a sub-stratum underlying all reality. Some call it Brahman, Tao, Mind, Emptiness, etc. Remove the distinctions, and what you have left is only One.
If still you are compelled to travel to far off places in searh of something that is already within you, it is karma.
May you be happy, may all beings be happy.
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| Darling Kaos: What you wrote, though true, is a statement for those who have crossed the necessity of company. What the OP is looking for is beneficial company.
For example: This bulletin board is a beneficial company!!! |
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| Namaste kulkarnn,
Who is it that seeks company and seeks to be somewhere other than where he/she is right here, right now, in this present moment.
It is the ego.
What one needs is to find out his/her true nature as opposed to figuring out the amount of fees one should be paying for an ashram somewhere.
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| I do not understand how one can say that? May be I am not getting your point. If I want to stay only in presence and go into logic as who is what and so on: Do you mean I should not pay my internet company? Should I not ask friends which Internet company I should use and how much they should charge me? Do you mean I should not use internet to talk to others considering who is talking to whom etc.? If someone wants a company to develop good habits, they want to go to a place where they shall find it. I am sure they would not find it in the bars in general. So, if they go to that place and obtain food/shelter while being there, the place may charge them fees. And, also including Yoga class may be. So, the OP is asking which places and how much cost. What is wrong with that? For me it is something like a Yoga Class. I want to learn yoga exercise, let us say, and want to be associated with those who do yoga exercise. Now, I find a place to learn, and obtain information how much it should cost. The same thing applies to learn other things. And, the OP is calling such a place Ashram, I believe.
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| kulkarnn - 2007-10-22 6:28 PM
... Now, I find a place to learn, and obtain information how much it should cost. The same thing applies to learn other things. And, the OP is calling such a place Ashram, I believe.
Hmm.. perhaps, first, we could charge people $1000 /mo. to stay in an ashram to find themselves.
Then, maybe, they will be "enlightened".
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| Hey Kaos, do not be kaotic. There are places that may be charging less or more. That is upto them. May be 1000 a month is not a great amount for the OP. I have friends who shall gladly pay 1000 for a month. In fact, they already pay more than that for their expenses. If the OP wants to pay that and the OP is getting whatever the OP wants, we should not worry about it.
Kaos - 2007-10-23 3:19 PM
kulkarnn - 2007-10-22 6:28 PM
... Now, I find a place to learn, and obtain information how much it should cost. The same thing applies to learn other things. And, the OP is calling such a place Ashram, I believe.
Hmm.. perhaps, first, we could charge people $1000 /mo. to stay in an ashram to find themselves.
Then, maybe, they will be "enlightened".
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| true experience,
I met a man who was an atist, he was subsituting for one of my helpers. All day he made art fro the children, he gave freely of his time and seemed to be walking in spirit so to speak. We had great conversations. Then I asked him at the end of the day if he could make a painting for me and of course I would pay him for his time and effort. The moment he talked about money I could see a change in him, he looked different.
maybe I am reflecting myself on to him or maybe not, I dont know. I do know for sure that the moment money became involved was the moment the spiritual left and the moment the physical came back.
just thoughts
seeker
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| Money is neither good nor bad and should be neither loved nor hated. Many people have emotional ties to money. Whether this attachment is positive or negative, it is not a healthy practice. Money is just like yoga; it is a tool. USE IT WISELY! Use it without attachment. |
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| Hey Kulharnn,
If you can charge $1000 for your "purely spiritual" services, surely, you can charge NOTHING.
Unless, of course, you consider your ego, the one providing your "spiritual services", and that profits of course, come first.
Edited by Kaos 2007-10-25 1:43 PM
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| Darling Kaos:
1. Please read the Original Post again for the query.
2. If you are interested in my response to that, read my posts. This is not must.
3. Your post does not answer original post and neither address my comments.
4. You made a point which I commented on. Instead of continuing that discussion, you diverted into money matters. And, I said money matters are between the business and the payer. Now, you are stating that I may be charging that amount. You are doing this without knowing what services I offer. This is very silly.
5. I do not offer Ashram or a service where a person can stay for 1 to 3 months. But, I do NOT feel 1000 a month is too much for most Americans to pay. In fact they already pay more amount for their monthly expenses. So, their paying that amount while staying at Ashram is no problem. Whether Ashram should charge that money, is between them and the payer.
6. Whether an officer of a particular company should get a six figure salary, whether a public servent of a country should be paid 6 figure salary, or whether Bill Gates should earn millions is a business between The one who earns and the one who spends. That does not address the original post.
7. Lastly, if you wish to offer a completely free service with food clothing shelter and also Yoga education to the OP at your place, you can come forward and do so.
Kaos - 2007-10-25 1:42 PM
Hey Kulharnn,
If you can charge $1000 for your "purely spiritual" services, surely, you can charge NOTHING.
Unless, of course, you consider your ego, the one providing your "spiritual services", and that profits of course, come first.
Edited by kulkarnn 2007-10-25 3:53 PM
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| kulkarnn - 2007-10-25 3:52 PM
... I do not offer Ashram or a service where a person can stay for 1 to 3 months. But, I do NOT feel 1000 a month is too much for most Americans to pay. In fact they already pay more amount for their monthly expenses. So, their paying that amount while staying at Ashram is no problem. Whether Ashram should charge that money, is between them and the payer.
You are wrong. First, you try to find a way around to justify your charging your clients to gain "spiritual" progress, awakening, whatever you want to call it.
You say, you do not feel $1000 a month is too much for most Americans to pay? So, what amount do you feel is too much? $1001?
You are right, when you mention that "spiritual" business, in this case, how much to charge for one to stay in an ashram, is, in your very own words, "a business between The one who earns and the one who spends", you merely put yourself in the position of a middle man, pocketing the difference between the one who earns and the one who spends.
Edited by Kaos 2007-10-25 4:38 PM
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 5098
 
Location: Somewhere in the Mountains of Western NC | kulkarnn - 2007-10-25 3:52 PM
7. Lastly, if you wish to offer a completely free service with food clothing shelter and also Yoga education to the OP at your place, you can come forward and do so.
Oh Goodie, a free retreat center at Kaos's place...let's see, we need lots of vegetarian, organic food, electricity and space heaters for some of us who like our yoga on the "warm" side.....and can we all wear brand new $100 yoga uniforms?? I need at least 3 to get me through the month. Oh yea, we need lots of honey and chai...this is to be served several times daily!!  |
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| kulkarnn - 2007-10-25 3:52 PM
7. Lastly, if you wish to offer a completely free service with food clothing shelter and also Yoga education to the OP at your place, you can come forward and do so.
Thanks for the suggestion, but perhaps, this issue is better addressed to those who seek to gain material profit in exchange for something "spiritual" whatever that means.
In the Bhagavad Gita, Krishna mentions:
A person who has given up all desires for sense gratification, who lives free from desires, who has given up all sense of proprietorship, and is devoid of false ego--he alone can attain real peace.
--BG 2.71
So, I hope the issue of how much to charge to stay in an ashram doesn't get back to you folks offering spiritual "enlightenment".
Edited by Kaos 2007-10-25 5:01 PM
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Expert Yogi
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Location: Somewhere in the Mountains of Western NC | Kaos, does this mean the retreat is OFF now???   |
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| Darling Kaos: You should be ashamed of yourself of writing 1. below without collecting sufficient facts. And, as for your quoting BG in 2., you definitely need to get enlightened, not only spiritually, but even materially. BG also states:
yuktaahaaravihaarasya.. the one who wants to practice Yoga should take appropriate diet, appropriate physical activity, appropriate rest, etc. etc.
It also states how different types of students practice different kinds of yajna depending on their background, etc.
Now, I do not know how the hell you are obtaining your food free of charge. And, how the hell any Ashram shall provide it free to their attendees.
You have also chosen to ignore Cyndi's posts to advance your WRONG point of view.
Interestingly, you are using a terminology of offering "spiritual enlightenment" for price. Ashram does not offer that if you know what Ashram means. My first post states that Ashram as originally mean does not exist today. Original ashrams offered FREE education, not because they actually offered it free, but because the kings and social institutes completely supported that effort. And, they offer only education. It is upto the students to obtain the enlightenment as you wrote in some of your posts 'from inside themselves'. But, the students need to get educated of how to do that and they might choose ashram or any means for it. If they choose today's Ashram, they shall not find it free, in most likelyhood. (except may be Kaotic Virtual Ashram).
Lastly, but not in the least, 1000 a month for all expenses is not a large amount. Your quoting 1001, etc shows immaturity. What is too much depends on who is paying. For average american where I live 1000 a month including food, and Yoga instruction is very little. 1000 a month is a monthly rental for a one room place in my county.
Kaos - 2007-10-25 5:00 PM
kulkarnn - 2007-10-25 3:52 PM
7. Lastly, if you wish to offer a completely free service with food clothing shelter and also Yoga education to the OP at your place, you can come forward and do so.
1. You are wrong. First, you try to find a way around to justify your charging your clients to gain "spiritual" progress, awakening, whatever you want to call it.
You say, you do not feel $1000 a month is too much for most Americans to pay? So, what amount do you feel is too much? $1001?
You are right, when you mention that "spiritual" business, in this case, how much to charge for one to stay in an ashram, is, in your very own words, "a business between The one who earns and the one who spends", you merely put yourself in the position of a middle man, pocketing the difference between the one who earns and the one who spends.
2. In the Bhagavad Gita, Krishna mentions:
A person who has given up all desires for sense gratification, who lives free from desires, who has given up all sense of proprietorship, and is devoid of false ego--he alone can attain real peace.
--BG 2.71
So, I hope the issue of how much to charge to stay in an ashram doesn't get back to you folks offering spiritual "enlightenment".
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| kaos I hear what you are saying
neel, did someone awaken your ego again and you are defending it, instead of always having to be the teacher on here, be the student occasionally or you may become stagnent. Still love you neel, but I have never been one to hold my tounge. Neel, you dont always have to be right, you can be wrong sometimes and that is ok.
enjoy your battles my friends, neel and kaos, for if you listen you may learn
seeker
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| Darling TS: I like to fight with sportsman spirit. I mean I have no problems with Kaos when it comes to giving hug or having a cup of tea. However, as far as posts are concerned, I agree, disagree, or fight depending on the situation. If I am not right, I should not be making a point. Knowingly, I should not make a right point. But, if my point was found wrong, I do not feel hesitation to agree. But, as for B.S. I can not agree unless it is a very simple b.s.
As for your interfernce, I have no problems. |
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| Away from the discussion in this post, I prostrate to Kaos and Tube Seeker, both. |
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| now neel, do you know what the initials B.S. may be percieved as?
and did you mean interference?
on the ride
seeker
Edited by tubeseeker 2007-10-26 12:07 AM
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| No TS. I meant:
Interference = your actions of love.
B.S. = statement 1. made by Kaos. |
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| kulkarnn - 2007-10-26 8:21 AM
No TS. I meant:
Interference = your actions of love.
B.S. = statement 1. made by Kaos.
precisely why I ask, because times I have assumed what you meant and I have been wrong to assume, you have helped to humble me in the area of assuming
you and your big words, you know the language better then I, and it is my first
so you know
B. S also stands for Bull S@$T, The second word is another name for feces, poo poo, number two, etc... It is basically saying someone is full of poop in there ideas/beliefs/words
it seems you have the big words mastered and I have the dirty words mastered, want to trade?
take care my friend
seeker
Edited by tubeseeker 2007-10-26 10:53 AM
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| I have to agree with Kaos on this one. Happyness and friendship can never be commercialized or found in romantic faraway places. Follow your heart and find people and places around you that can deepen your practice. Or go to India if that is your wish but follow your own heart and make your own way. Dont just go someplace based on credentials and popularity.
My personal experience with an Ashram here in the U.S. was very enlightening - in the sense of complete disillusionment - in so many ways. I visited the Sivananda Ashram in upstate New York about ten years ago. My complete openness and vulnerability of having the best of intentions as a result of my faith in this practice and community of 'yogis' were met with two things. For one thing I experienced racial prejudice for the first time in my twenty something years of life here in America as my friendly and enthusiastic yet platonic - i was a practicing celibate at the time - advances were met with hostility and suspicion from the women and disrespect infringing on ridicule by the men. A mistrustful and guarded approach had served me well in avoiding such prejudice in the past. They taught Asanas not yoga there along with a bunch of fancy hindu words as their groupie lingo and not much else. Which leads to the second result of the pompous, self-absorbed social dropout 'yogis' there who couldn't find anything else to do with their lives. They were committed to dogmatically transmitting the teachings of their idol 'guru master' - no disrespect to Swami Sivananda himself - by a strict adherence and regurgitation of what they were taught without a sufficiently deeper understanding of what was involved to evolve this knowledge any further. Any deviance from their discourse in questioning would be met with a devoted albeit confused quotation of 'something the master said'. Eventually the 'swami' there resorted to discrediting me and criticizing my practice rather than exploring what I was attempting to discuss! For example if I inquired how different postures affected the flow of energy and attempted to experiment with variations of postures, or even failed to do them in the 'sivananda' sequence, his conclusion was merely that I was doing the postures wrong.
And of course his wise conclusion that I would do such a thing because I needed attention. Which is sort of what I am doing by posting a controversial thread such as this by was of introduction since I am new. Greets. |
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| Dear Annikein: I am sorry that you had a dissatisfactory experience in the place you mentioned. Though I have not visited there myself, and I should not talk about that place authentically without first hand experience, I am amazed that many of my friends here in DC have extremely satisfactory experience there, and also, they have been regularly going there for many (10!) years.
I feel that the connection between the students and that place, their trust system, etc. form a lot in their getting what they want and their satisfaction as well.
That is why my response to OP stated that he/she should know what they are looking for. In fact, it may be a good idea to visit places and watch what is going on before commiting a longer time.
However, since the OP wants to spend less and wants to go far away, that option is limited. But, if the person has already reached a level where happiness can be achieved in their own self, they do not need any outside stuff, including this bulletin board or advice from others.
Unfortunately, just finding happiness within oneself, just being self aware, living in the present time, etc. are all methods that are not plausible for average ones. And, ironically, these methods are professed and founded by those who previously did not follow the same, but who previously followed traditional methods.
The above statement applies to Shree Gautam Buddha also.
OM ShantiH |
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Yes. At the same time, I understand that my experiences were a result of my choice to be non-conformist, both in the sense of wanting to engage in a practice that is rather 'alternative' to western American culture, but also to want to explore taking the practice even further than what was being taught. Ah, let the sheep people be sheep i suppose, and not expect them to be anything more. |
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Expert Yogi
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| Clearly it was not the right place for you. Chalk it up to experience and move on. I am curious - why are you still hanging on to this experience 10 years later? Have you found a practice style and/or teacher that agrees with you? |
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Ashram
