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Expert Yogi
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Location: Somewhere in the Mountains of Western NC | GreenJello - 2007-09-05 8:57 PM
Cyndi - 2007-09-05 7:40 PM
Relax. Somebody's bound to come along really soon and hit the nail on the head for ya.
Ya think that somebody's likely to nail him, wink, wink, nudge, nudge?
Not I. I'll leave it to the professional "expert" yogis of yoga.com,  |
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| Dear Starzin:
It is atually you, who is not making your situation clear. And, that is why you are getting all the same points again and again. I see all the following symptoms in you. Correct me if you want:
a) I see that you are not used to playing with girls from your childhood and have been kept possibly isolated from them. And, therefore, you feel not so natural in their company. I myself was like that until I came to USA at the age of 30. Of course, I was not shy, but I was not used to talking with ladies for long. Boy, I am glad that I made an attempt to overcome this, because it was must for my IT profession.
b) I see that you are possibly lacking friendship due to your ways with girls. This is because, it is impossible to avoid girls in today's society. Of course, if you are going towards Monkhood, then you should avoid them. But, if you are going to stay in the society, then you must NOT avoid them.
c) I suggest you the following: Talk this issue peacefully with your parents, and close friends if you have any. Also, definitely meet the girls considering them as your sister, mother, whatever you like. If the girls of your age are not cooperating, meet them at clubs such as Toast Masters, Yoga Studios, Sports places, Gyms, etc. If your family allows, try to get into relation with one girl, as a girl-friend/wife/fiance/etc. I myself can not have a girl friend. She has to be my wife. I married my wife right away. But, considering your age, position, etc., if you were my son, and wanting to live in USA, you can not avoid this issue.
d) If you want to avoid Girl Friend issue, and still have friends, you can move to India. You shall have no problems. I guarantee you.
e) I think your issue is more social and you are trying to address it by Yoga practice, a wrong approach. |
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| Gotta agree with Neel on that. Just putting yourself in a position to deal with women as people is HUGE! Definitely a nice side effect of going to a studio. |
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Expert Yogi
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| I am wondering if it would help if we changed the topic of the object of desire, strazin? If we discussed this as a desire for fast cars (not a biological urge in itself, though the desire for acquisition or for speed is, I think) or food? I sense that you are more interested in the aspect of quenching the desire or removing attachment to it than the aspect of "how to deal with women" in general. Yes? |
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Extreme Veteran
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Location: Oregon | strazin: Alright. It looks like nobody really understands my situation or my goals. We keep hammering on the same points over and over again. That's fine. I'm sure you all tried your best. But I am closing the discussion of this topic from my end.
Dude. Most of us have been there one way or another. Hell, I'm 40, divorced and still struggling with finding the right balance for intimacy. I really have no "desire" to be celibate. I think we have these heart and minds and bodies to share. The best advice I've seen for you is get a girl friend. I personally had trouble with that at 20. The only issue I had then with having a libido, was not having anyone to share it with.
Cyndi: You're never going to find perfect, but what you do have to find is COMPROMISE. I think men have big issues with that lost art. Women really are more open to it than you think they are.
I really had to choke on this. I'll say simply, that has not been my experience with women. Most men I talk to say the same, there simply is no compromise with women. I'd suggest the toothpaste cap example might be more about retentiveness than compromise. I'll also own that I'm retentive. But retentive is about small things. Compromise is about bigger issues. And it's near impossible to get a woman to declare anything on a big issue, much less move to the middle.
Green Jello: One day a woman worthy of compromising for will show up, until that time I'm going to keep on keeping on.
I'd suggest modifying that outlook. Don't compromise for anyone. But find someone you can compromise with. I gave up a lot of stuff I think all come secondary to a relationship, but the other didn't see it that way. I could probably give up or delay on those things again. But this time, I'll only do it with someone who sees why it's worth it, and truly joins me in life. Which is why I say compromise with someone, make it a conscious joint endeavor. |
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Expert Yogi
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| Yes - compromising WITH (I can't do italics...) is a good way of putting it. For the toothpaste example - instead of whining, whinging and feeling oh-so-sorry for oneself - buy two tubes! Keeps the germs separate, too. When a couple is in the midst of such a tug-of-war, such simple solutions are often not obvious   |
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| That's a good point, I like the idea of compromising WITH somebody. I really felt like I was doing ALL the compromising in the last relationship I was in, so the idea of compromising with is a really good one. |
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| kulkarnn - 2007-09-05 11:32 PM
It is atually you, who is not making your situation clear. And, that is why you are getting all the same points again and again.
You could be right. Okay. I will explain the particulars of my situation in great detail. Read if you are interested.
kulkarnn - 2007-09-05 11:32 PM
a) I see that you are not used to playing with girls from your childhood and have been kept possibly isolated from them. And, therefore, you feel not so natural in their company.
No. I have been around females my whole life. I went to coed schools, where the girls and boys talked freely with one another. But there is another issue which is probably related to what you are trying to say.
I have a sharp facial deformity. My lower jaw extends about one inch in front of my upper jaw. It gives my face an extremely hostile, aggressive look. This is probably why I make such a negative first impression on others, particularly females, when I first approach them. I do not blame them. My own mother cringes when I smile. "That's not really how you smile is it?" she once asked in surprise.
Of course, since the first grade, the other kids teased me mercilessly about my face whenever I laughed or smiled or did anything else which showed my teeth. So gradually, I learned a valuable life lesson: Do not laugh or smile.
I did cry a lot, though, when I was a kid. Although, interestingly, the kids were pretty tame when compared to what the dentists had to say. "Oh dear God! Look at his teeth! Hey guys come look at this. Oh man, poor kid, you need surgery."
I am not exaggerating. In fact, the dentists filled my head with many horrible ideas (not health related in any way) which I will not mention here. And yes, these are the same dentists which claim to occasionally help people.
Naturally, I became very self-conscious and bitter. Finally, in high school, I discovered the wonderful art of self-deprecating humor. I learned to take a step back and make fun of myself with style and flare. I beat the living snot out of my self-esteem before anyone else had a chance. This took the wind out of their sails. Now, people thought I was funny. Or mentally retarded.
Eventually, in college, I gradually learned to get over it. Detachment from the body in a way. Now, I go out and smile -- yes, even at the expense of others. Sucks for them! And I started making an effort to socialize.
kulkarnn - 2007-09-05 11:32 PM
I think your issue is more social and you are trying to address it by Yoga practice, a wrong approach.
I am trying to address this issue on many different fronts, including yoga. I have recently been forcing myself to go out and participate in more social activities. I became a writer for my college newspaper. I joined the improvisational comedy club. I have started doing volunteer work for community service which allows me to interact with a wide variety of people. I also spent a good part of the summer in Berkeley, staying with some friends who are going to college there. I tried an experiment. Every day, I went out on the street and talked to five random females, just being friendly and casual, trying to keep the conversation going for as long as possible. I approached about 200 females in this way. I have never been more frightened in my life. I was completely terrified, especially in the beginning. So it was a very good experience for me. I also plan on trying standup comedy someday soon. I don’t plan on being good. It is just another big thing I am very afraid of doing. I have also been trying to start my own software company since the summer, which I really believe will succeed, maybe within two or three years.
However, I believe that yoga is by far the best option. My goal is to find a source of inner strength which is independent of a female’s approval, a strength which is unaffected by mean children, retarded dentists, and pretty girls. If you do not believe that meditation can develop this type of inner strength, then I don’t know what to tell you. (By the way, people, please reread this paragraph, and then reread it again. THIS is my goal. My goal is NOT to get laid. My goal is NOT to meet girls or get married.)
kulkarnn - 2007-09-05 11:32 PM
b) I see that you are possibly lacking friendship due to your ways with girls. This is because, it is impossible to avoid girls in today's society. Of course, if you are going towards Monkhood, then you should avoid them. But, if you are going to stay in the society, then you must NOT avoid them.
Yes, I was never one of the popular kids. But I have always had a group of 3-4 close friends at all times in my life.
kulkarnn - 2007-09-05 11:32 PM
c) If your family allows, try to get into relation with one girl, as a girl-friend/wife/fiance/etc.
No. I have no intention of ever getting married or having kids. It ends here with me. I also do not depend on my parents for financial support. I have been paying my way through college and supporting all my expenses for the past three years by playing poker for a living (and I go to Carnegie Mellon, so it ain’t cheap).
Poker is actually the main reason that I have become so interested in yoga. I made a decent amount of money playing the game over the last few years, and I was very happy with my success for a while. But sometime last year, I had an epiphany. I realized that I didn’t even spend any money. It just piled up in my bank account and had no function other than an empty source of pride. It was useless. I tried spending it on some nice things: Big TV, fancy computers, fancy clothes, etc. But none of this really did it for me. I realized that (cliché alert) money did not make me happy.
I crashed so hard after I understood this. Does anyone else know what this feels like? To work so hard for more than two years, investing all your time and energy to achieve a goal. Then you finally get it. But suddenly you realize, “Wait, this is stupid.”
I lost all my drive to play poker and continue making money after this. I lost my drive to study and start a career. I nearly dropped out of school at one point. “What is the point?” I kept asking myself. “This is not who I am.” I became very depressed for a while, about six months. I put some money aside for my education. Then I gave the rest to my parents and my sister. I told them they could spend it all on gumballs if they wished. Now, I was poor again.
I desperately searched around for other ways to spend my time. This is when I started experimenting with the random social activities I described above. Eventually, I stumbled across the Bhagavad Gita somewhere on the internet. I read through it and became extremely confused, though somewhere deep inside, I was inspired.
I knew right then that the Gita contained the solution. It spoke of a consciousness which supersedes all dualities, pain and pleasure, rich and poor, ugly and beautiful. This idea shed a new light on my recent feelings of disillusionment. I felt that I was already making much progress on this path. I had already become detached from wealth and greed (although, strangely, I am still pursuing my idea for a software company. I am not sure why I am doing it. It is not for money. Perhaps it is just curiosity.) And I had also become fairly detached from my body, as I learned to view my deformed face with humor. I wanted to completely master this mindset and achieve the mental control the Gita spoke so highly of. Thus, I immediately started to practice meditation and have been practicing since then.
However, I quickly realized that even with those two obstacles out of the way, there are still many more I must overcome, particularly my attachment to females. Intellectually, I know that the sexual desire is empty, just as my desire for money was empty. However, my brain is not cooperating with me. It refuses to accept what I know to be true. It insists on obsessing over females, even though I KNOW that the desire is meaningless and counterproductive. It is a frustrating battle.
This is why I posted my original question on the boards. I want to convince my brain to get over the sexual desire so that I can continue on my path of meditation. I am very happy when I make progress with my meditation. It is the only substantial form of happiness I have ever experienced.
Anyway, this is my life story at twenty. I hope you enjoyed. I still do not expect anyone to understand, as I have already told this story to my family and friends many times. They all think I am insane.
Edited by strazin 2007-09-07 7:30 AM
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| Probably your brain is just reacting to your bodies natural hormones. From your original post you wrote:
I never realized that I had so little control, and it really bothers me.
To me it seems not reacting to your feelings is control. I think your learning your lessons from the hand that life dealt you, and thats admirable. You're continuing to learn, and not being hard or bitter. Don't beat yourself up because you have feelings. You're moving forward, and you're open to life. You should pat yourself on the back, and continue your journey. |
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| strazin - 2007-09-07 7:18 AM
However, I quickly realized that even with those two obstacles out of the way, there are still many more I must overcome, particularly my attachment to females. Intellectually, I know that the sexual desire is empty, just as my desire for money was empty. However, my brain is not cooperating with me. It refuses to accept what I know to be true. It insists on obsessing over females, even though I KNOW that the desire is meaningless and counterproductive. It is a frustrating battle.
Intellectual understanding is not useful when dealing with your emotions or desires.
In the case of the money, you came to this conclusion via experience, rather than detached intellectual exercise. I suggest that you overcome your attachment to women in the same manner. Get to know them, talk to them, have a girlfriend or two. Fall in love, experience another person really deeply. Get your heart broken, break some other people's hearts. Experience joy and sadness. Find out that it IS a hollow experience for you, rather than just attempting to convince yourself with mental arguments. I feel that anything else is just sitting there on the battlefield refusing to fight. |
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| strazin - 2007-09-07 3:18 PM
My goal is to find a source of inner strength which is independent of a female’s approval, a strength which is unaffected by mean children, retarded dentists, and pretty girls. If you do not believe that meditation can develop this type of inner strength, then I don’t know what to tell you.
Meditation can develop this type of inner strength, though with regular practise it may still take you decades to achieve....
With regard to your orginal question on controlling your desire when you see women. If you believe that your sexual feelings are above and beyond what is normal for your age and sex then begin to recognise that these are only fleeting, surface feelings that you are experiencing and practise this extreme but effective Buddhist technique:
Picture in your mind the same person with no skin covering their body and as you imagine looking at their bloody vein covered muscles, ask yourself if you still desire them now? Or imagine them old or with a horrible skin disease. Are they still attractive to you now?
You mention that you meditate for 30 mins, twice a day. What type of meditation do you practise?
Jonathon
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| dear Starzin:
Now, you shall accept that your OP does not convey what you wanted to say or ask. Anyway, do not give up. You are an amazingly great person. I shall have to do further talk with you in person, if you choose to do so. Your problem is not a general problem, but a particular situation. And, the solution has to be particular, too. |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 399
Location: Oregon | strazin, thank you for sharing all that.
It makes my comment about getting a girlfriend seem almost callous. It wasn't, of course. But you definitely have a unique case. And it's clear why you have arrived where you are at 20. Perhaps that is your path, to control this desire.
Beauty really does lie within, and sometimes it's the exterior that shapes the interior.
I have an old friend who was born with no nerves in has face and a club foot. The club foot you can cover up. The no nerves in his face is what affects him daily. He cannot smile. If you know him, you quickly recognize how he laughs, his whole body moves. But on first impression, he looks like a grown kid with downs syndrome. He's pretty open about this. But what he's not so open about is how much crap he got growing up. I met another person in college who said he went to elementary school with him, and he related how awful people were to him.
What I admire most about Larry is how much he's had to overcome. He's one of the funniest people I know. He doesn't make fun of himself. But he's also one of the most fair people I know. In college, when we were all sitting around drinking or whatever, and throwing around good natured put downs, if someone was getting picked on too much, he'd be the first to place a zinger on the person who was too cool for school. He knew what it was like to be the one picked on, and he'd even it up.
I'm currently doing Improv for a similar reason as you chatted up the 200 girls, it places in me in a challenging situation. I think comedy and Improv would be great outlets. We have a guy in the troupe who is slay-me-dead funny. Overweight in the John Candy way, and he refers to his physique often in his act. I would suggest be self-depreciating, it's a good way to disarm people--you've already figured that out. But, dammit, be kind to yourself! Don't ever be brutal.
And also know, there are people out there who will recognize what is within you. The first time I met Larry was at a football game, and I thought someone was bringing a retarded kid to a football game, sort of as a social service. He became one of my best friends and a roommate for 3 years.
Ok, I hope I haven't overstepped my bounds or jumped to conclusions.
I have an idea for a book you might read, sort of related to poker and money and satisfaction with success that gives you money. But explaining why might be too complex. If you're interested, Private Message me. |
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| jonnie - 2007-09-07 10:34 AM
You mention that you meditate for 30 mins, twice a day. What type of meditation do you practise?
I practice the following: Focus on the point between the eyebrows. Visualize the bright sun at that point. Hear the sound OM emanating from the point. Feel the breath flowing through the point. I try to coordinate all three senses together into the single point simultaneously. If I am focussing well, I also add another spice. I imagine certain positive qualities symbolized by the sun: strength, love, confidence, courage, freedom. |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 8442
| strazin - I am overwhelmed by your story and soooo impressed at how you have dealt with it. One thing that we have probably already said is that you really need to be patient with yourself. The level of understanding you have reached at such a young age with essentially no guidance is amazing. I say stay in school and go ahead and make tons of money. You will find a good use for it, I'm sure Read the Dalai Lama's works. Read Eknath Eswaren. Keep practicing, keep meditating and continue on your path to being a great person. And keep being funny - life without laughter is no life at all  |
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| strazin,
You are receiving a lot of advice here. For a palate freshener, try reading some J. Krishnamurti.
Namaste,
jimg |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 5098
Location: Somewhere in the Mountains of Western NC | DJ Dre - 2007-09-06 6:55 PM
Cyndi: You're never going to find perfect, but what you do have to find is COMPROMISE. I think men have big issues with that lost art. Women really are more open to it than you think they are.
I really had to choke on this. I'll say simply, that has not been my experience with women. Most men I talk to say the same, there simply is no compromise with women. I'd suggest the toothpaste cap example might be more about retentiveness than compromise. I'll also own that I'm retentive. But retentive is about small things. Compromise is about bigger issues. And it's near impossible to get a woman to declare anything on a big issue, much less move to the middle.
Well, Dr. Dre...if that made you choke, perhaps there's something else going on here.
I find it interesting that you tried to un-validate my statements just because you had a terrible experience with women. I could go back into my history with men and tell you all kinds of stories about how phsycho men have treated me. You have no idea.
Anyway, that 's beside the point. I used to claim the "victim" and "bashed and battered" syndrome when it came to my relationships with men and break ups. However, I got to a point where I learned that the universe brought every single one of those experiences to me so that I could learn and grow. It's amazing when you start looking at it from that perspective, rather than choosing to be a victim of it. It's also amazing when you take those experiences and apply them to how you deal with any relationship. I like to think of my relationships as my studies of the human experiment...oops, experience,
The funny part of all now days... I LOVE MEN. I'm always going to be the girl who plays with the boys next door. The leader of the boys club. All my friends are boys...or men, whichever...doesn't matter, cause I'm still a girl at heart,  |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 5098
Location: Somewhere in the Mountains of Western NC | tourist - 2007-09-06 7:56 PM
Yes - compromising WITH (I can't do italics... ) is a good way of putting it. For the toothpaste example - instead of whining, whinging and feeling oh-so-sorry for oneself - buy two tubes! Keeps the germs separate, too. When a couple is in the midst of such a tug-of-war, such simple solutions are often not obvious
Well, I never meant anything else...my definition of a compromise is not a one-sided issue. It takes 2 to tango....it also takes 2 to compromise, otherwise it is not a compromise!! Then it becomes something else...like a SACRIFICE...and I definitely do not believe in that, unless of course it is BY CHOICE. I've done those too. Some have been successful, whereas some have not.
I WAS NEVER obsessed with the toothpaste issue. I could of cared less. I'm the footloose fancy free spirit....this guy was not. He was anal-retentive about everything!! It was obvious that I brought something to that relationship that he didn't dare want to face about himself. He couldn't handle me and that was okay....I would of had to SACRIFICE in that relationship, and that would NOT have been a very wise choice for that particular man. BECAUSE....
Several months later I met my next husband and we had our beautiful daughter together. Even though we are now divorced, we are still very close and are best friends. It's a beautiful relationship...better than having a husband,  |
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Expert Yogi
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| Cyndi - I think a lot of people get compromise and sacrifice confused, don't you? And I agree, sometimes sacrifice is the right path. It takes a certain degree of maturity to be able to sacrifice wisely. I am treading a path like that now. For many, many years, I sat at home while my husband ran around and had fun with his sports. Now he is not able to spend those many hours away from home and wants me to be available to do things with him. But in the meantime I have taken up practicing and teaching and want and need that time for my own activities. Rather than being aggressive and selfish about it, I am trying to take the attitude I wish he had during those years and find a good balance between time I am entitled to and recognizing his needs as well. Of course now and then when he whines about having to spend another evening alone, I just tell him this is karma at work and he just has to suck it up! |
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Extreme Veteran
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Location: Oregon | Cyndi, I didn't start with sexism, such as: I think men have big issues with that lost art (of compromise). I am not trying to invalidate your experience. And I've got my experience, but I also said it's not just me, but most men I talk with. I take issue with the broad stroke you used. I think men compromise just fine.
Not sure if you're suggesting I'm playing a victim or not. I don't think I am. Mostly I've been a fool. I made a bad choice and didn't see signs the whole time. I am owning that more than at any other time in my life. I may be bitter, but I'm no victim. It's my fault for not seeing things as they really are.
FWIW, I haven't had terrible experiences with women. But I do feel used and discarded. I don't particularly like being an experiment or an experience for someone else. You could be right, though... maybe that's the path I'm supposed to embrace. |
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Expert Yogi
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Location: Somewhere in the Mountains of Western NC | DJ Dre - 2007-09-11 12:37 AM
Cyndi, I didn't start with sexism, such as: I think men have big issues with that lost art (of compromise). I am not trying to invalidate your experience. And I've got my experience, but I also said it's not just me, but most men I talk with. I take issue with the broad stroke you used. I think men compromise just fine.
Sexism??? Come on', that statement is NOT sexist. I'm sorry you took it that way. That was not my intention. Men too, do have lots of issues when it comes to emotional things and dealing with women. From what you stated in your experience, you yourself had or have some issues. I've had my share too, so therefore, you can't say that was sexist. I'm definitely NOT claiming superiority in this department. I never denied my old issues, I'm just an old "has-been" and "been there and done that" when it comes to relationships gone sour. I can't even count how many relationships I've had. All I can say, is that it certainly has provided me with enough wisdom to know when something's F**ked up about it or when its not going favorable, to get the hell out. HOWEVER, I will dare say this. Haven't you ever heard the statement, "Men are from Mars, Women are from Venus"?? The lost art that I'm referring to is that in today's world, Men have lost the art in dealing with women. Women have also lost the art in dealing with Men. Its not something thats being taught by parents anymore. In fact, its getting rather complicated and is the reason I think we have more Gay and Lesbians in today's society. No one wants to try to learn how to deal with the opposite sex anymore. It comes from having a lack of understanding about the true nature of each sex...male and female. Most children today have no clue because their parents have F**ked up and/or broken relationships. There are other reasons too, I just don't have the energy to list all the reasons...but, you get the jist of it, right?
For the record, I think women compromise just fine too. In fact, not only do I think we compromise just fine, I think we also sacrafice more than men do. But, see that's my perspective based on my observations and experience. I don't think there is a right or wrong answer here. So, we should leave that one alone....for sure,
Not sure if you're suggesting I'm playing a victim or not.
Playing the victim is kinda like going into survival mode...we all do it as a first initial reaction...especially when it comes to relationships that have gone awry. Doesn't matter if we are the fool, or made bad choices. My belief is that there is no bad choice...it's all karma. We can't stop it unless we're ahead of ourselves. Even when we *think* we've got it....it has a way of turning *nasty* back onto us if we aren't careful. Which is why I LOVE YOGA!! It's the only salvation to negative karma, I believe.
FWIW, I haven't had terrible experiences with women. But I do feel used and discarded. I don't particularly like being an experiment or an experience for someone else. You could be right, though... maybe that's the path I'm supposed to embrace.
Well that's a contradictory statement. You haven't had "terrible" experiences, but you feel used and discarded. Hmm?? I'm sorry if you were offended by my experiment/experience statement. That was merely my observation about the human life condition. From a yogic viewpoint, it is a life experience or karma. Relationships are part of our journey...not our destination. Some are brief, some are long-lasting and some may even last for 7 lifetimes. It's the karmic attachments that we have that keep us bound to these relationships. It's an interesting concept to observe, analyse and study. Unfortunately, our society and cultures also keep us bound and chained to relationships and the idea of it all. Frankly, its all BS if you ask me. But, that's coming from someone who has realized that I can't take my relationships with me and am slowly gradually getting my fill of the entire concept of relationships. Frankly, I get upset at times that I was manipulated and used myself...all in the name of Relationships...Marriage....oh, and if you have a kid with someone, they think you are bound for eternity....NOT. I've been divorced 3 times. My last husband is the only person that I have a deep respect for that I would even consider coming back and having a relationship with. But then again, Hindsite is such a perfect science,
Yes, Tourist, I do believe confusion lies somewhere between Compromise and Sacrifice....been there and done that too!
Edited by Cyndi 2007-09-11 6:47 PM
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What a difference an R makes
sp, check
Edited by SCThornley 2007-09-12 10:44 AM
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 8442
| ascent magazine http://www.ascentmagazine.com has some fascinating articles about desire and sexuality this issue. Both "a wheel in motion-examining the potential of our own hidden wisdom" by Swami Radha and "being present with desire" by Noah Levine are great. Both are online. |
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Extreme Veteran
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Location: Oregon | Men have lost the art in dealing with women. Women have also lost the art in dealing with Men.
Well, now... if you had said that last part in the post a ways back this would have been preventable. But see, you also said: For the record, I think women compromise just fine too. In fact, not only do I think we compromise just fine, I think we also sacrafice more than men do.
I used to agree with statements like that. I don't any more. We each contribute. It's the keeping score that has to stop.
FWIW, I wasn't offended by your experiment/experience metaphor. All I can say is that I'm not wired that way. I mated for life. That's not a cultural pressure, it just is. I don't look at relationship as an experiment or temporary thing. Or I didn't. Now, in some ways, I do have to look at it differently. |
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Expert Yogi
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Location: Somewhere in the Mountains of Western NC | DJ Dre - 2007-09-15 9:00 AM
Men have lost the art in dealing with women. Women have also lost the art in dealing with Men.
Well, now... if you had said that last part in the post a ways back this would have been preventable. But see, you also said: For the record, I think women compromise just fine too. In fact, not only do I think we compromise just fine, I think we also sacrafice more than men do.
geez, don't take it so literally. Are you going to pick my words apart DJ?? If you think about that word sacrifice and what I may have meant by that. Men don't have babies and their emotions are not as intense. I'm speaking generally here and based on the western society era 15-20 years ago. Which to some men that may seem weak or they may think we are out of control. It's really not easy being a woman, we are very sensitive. We also worry alot about our children, others children, then some of us worry about the children of the earth, because we are similar to Mother Earth..we are the givers of life and we are the caretakers of the children. If you ever give birth to a child, then you understand this concept of what I'm talking about. My experience with men is that they don't think about women on these terms. I'm sure the womens' equal rights movement is partly to blame and what destroyed this about men and women in our society.
I used to agree with statements like that. I don't any more. We each contribute. It's the keeping score that has to stop.
Who the hell has time to keep score. I could barely keep up with my self, much less keeping score....although...I have seen these people and couples...they drive me totally INSANE.
FWIW, I wasn't offended by your experiment/experience metaphor. All I can say is that I'm not wired that way. I mated for life. That's not a cultural pressure, it just is. I don't look at relationship as an experiment or temporary thing. Or I didn't. Now, in some ways, I do have to look at it differently.
Yes, I know this about alot of people who mate for life and so on. I once thought that about myself...until....I took the Yoga plunge...that all changed drastically. Especially about the relationships being temporary and all.
Actually, we all have our differences and we all have our "unique" karmas. I know mine have been extraordinarly unique, to say the least. I also think we experience them and have our own way of processing them and life. Another words, we all have a different set of glasses on.
When I came into yoga, it sure did help my seeing things alot more healthier. On the other hand, there were parts to my practice that were so blatant and scary too. Talk about eye openers. At first, I used to wish I could go back and be a normal person and not have to see these things and be safe and all. I managed to pull through...as they say, "through the grace of the guru". So much truth in that.
Okay, its been fun having this chat DJ. Take care,
Edited by Cyndi 2007-09-15 9:39 AM
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Desire
