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| Here is my question: How many yogis have memorized the Sutras? During my on-going training in Austin, I am finding more and more instructors that have memorized either all or part of the Yoga Sutras. So much to know about yoga, it's history and it's philosophy....what a great journey so far!  |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 8442
    
| All? Yikes! I am in the midst of memorizing 5, which is plenty, thanks. It feels a bit like
Sunday school. The only one I have known for a long time is chitta vritti nirodah. |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 5098
Location: Somewhere in the Mountains of Western NC | I don't memorize the sutras..I learn them by understanding their meaning and also by practicing recitation. I think that is more important. There are so many Sutras, in fact, I'm reading and studying the Brahma Sutras right now. I've been studying them for 3+ years now...I can't quote most of them off the top of my head, in fact, I can barely quote any of them, but I sure do understand the translation and have a clear understanding about their meaning. To me that is more valuable that spouting them off. My husband has taught me several mantras and sutras....I write them down. When I do pooja without him, I read them. Some I know by heart by now, by practicing them. Some I have to read and even then I forget how to pronounce them the way I wrote them down,  |
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| I'm not a big fan of rote memorization either.
I know way too many "book" smart yogis who think the whole point is the be able to regurgitate knowledge. Unfortunately, this approach is strongly favored in western schools, and so in many western students.
However, being able to recite back the lesson is really at a much much lower level of understanding than being able to apply the lesson. I'm much more interested in yogis who can DO something with the sutras, than just talk about it. If yoga is just a debate topic, I'm done. |
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| There are many who learn and recite the Sutras. The recorded version is sooo sweet to listen to. But it's not to be confused with knowledge, this memorization. many have memorized with out application. Knowledge without application is empty.
But to do that sort of thing, to have that sort of commitment, is something. Just not required and not to be confused with living the Sutras which in my opinion trumps the ability to recite or remember them. |
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Location: Upstate NY | An ounze of practice is worth more than tons of theory  |
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| Ravi - 2006-08-28 8:35 AM
An ounze of practice is worth more than tons of theory
Sweet!
and it is our practice that makes us what we are.
If it's in a book, I know where to find it.
If it's in my life, then I'm living it.
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| i'm like SCT on this one.
i don't memorize them. i don't try to memorize them. but, if i utilize them over and over (certain ones), then i might remember a rough translation of them. that's about it.
but that's from use, not from trying to memorize it. if we needed to memorize it, why would it be written down? |
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| I was waiting for my chiropractor the other day and found a pamphlet for a local yoga studio. I opened it up to read it and found that Neel is giving a workshop on the Sutras here in Sept. I think I'd probably understand more of them in this type of format. I've read parts of different translations, afterawhile, a few have sunk in... I think I'm going to try to make this workshop.. I have to do a little rearranging at work... but we'll see. |
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| i think it would be cool to be able to go.
admittedly, working with any scripture can be difficult because there are layers of meaning within the word choices, the word orders, and all of htat. there are contexts within contexts within contexts.
imagine a person from the east, who has never read the bible or seen one, just picking it up and trying to 'get' it. it's the same challenge for westerners picking up eastern stuff. this is why studying the context of the scriptures--the history and traditions from which it comes and responds to--really helps illuminate the meaning.
i think that learning from Neel or someone like him would be a great opportunity to begin scriptural studies in the yoga/vedanta tradition. |
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| Dear Yoga Com Friends:
Namaste. I returned last night from India. The vacation was filled with joy, rain, meeting loved ones, Sanskrit Studies with one of the world's Sanskrit scholars, Dr. G.U. Thite, and above all publishing of my latest book, "Yoga Sutras of Patanjali, Proper Translation & Chanting". This book has original sutras, English Transliteration, Proper Word Sequence (Anvaya), Proper meaning of Each word, Delienation of hidden words, English Sentence meaning of each Sutra with only essential commentary elements, Key to pronunciation, and 140 min - 2 Audio CD set which instructs in chanting and also shows the result of such instruction in an uninterrupted chanting. The book has a Foreword by a famous Sanskrit Scholar and Poet, Dr. Deviprasad Kharwandikar of Ahmednagar, India. The cost is: $30 only book, $30 only 2-CDs set, and $50 - book with 2 CDs. Out of state mailing should cost $5, I suppose. It shall be the text book for my course at Sun and Moon Yoga, starting on 9th Sept. The book is hard, cloth bound, with best quality paper and CDs in pocket of the back cover.
I also met Prashant Iyengar who presented me an autographed copy of his latest work, Alpha and Omega of Trikonasana. I finished studying it in the airplane. So, I wish to present it to someone else. I am thinking of Tourist (where are you?).
I also published a 3 CD set Meditation course, and some other works.
Peace and Joy
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| Wow! Good to see... er hear... see you type again Neel. So if we act now, can we get an autographed copy of the book? |
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| Yes GJ, though my autograph is less important than the contents of the book. |
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| kulkarnn - 2006-08-29 11:39 AM
Yes GJ, though my autograph is less important than the contents of the book.
Modest too! |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 5098
Location: Somewhere in the Mountains of Western NC | This is interesting. Over the weekend I was out of town and took my Patanjali's Yogasutras book with me for reading. This is the version that is translated and commented by T.K.V. Desikachar. In the preface it mentions about the Sutras. It says this and I QUOTE:
Yoga is one of the Darsanas. It's author is Patanjali, about whom little is known. There are those who believe he is the incarnation of the divine serpent Ananta which supports the whole universe. Others identify him with Patanjali the grammarian, who lived in the seond century before our era. Patanjali has presented his work in the style known as the Sutra. Sutra is defined as that style which has few words, yet is free from ambiguity, full of essence, universal in context, and affirmative.
Okay, here comes my point after giving you the tidbit above...
Words of the Sutra, put together, do not even form a complete sentence, but they offer enough for the teacher to deveolp the message. The Sutra links the teacher and teaching, but by itself it cannot explain every point. Its style condenses the message to a terseness that cannot be corrupted; yet it can be learned by heart so that no part is lost. In fact, the first step in receiving instruction is to learn the Sutras by heart. The teacher trains the aspirant to recite the Sutras EXACTLY as he does. (We must remember that oral instruction prevailed at that time). Only then does the teacher begin to expound the meaning.
Then it goes onto say that Yoga is not an original invention of Patanjali, nor does he says so. Yoga -- the word and the idea -- is found in the Vedas, Upinashads and other Indian texts. Different meanings are also available. Indeed, yoga may mean almost anything. Patanjali uses his ingenuity in defining it in relation to mental activity.
Anyway, I thought that was rather interesting. Although, I do think knowing the Sutra by heart is vital to this practice, I also think that the cultural differences in the west are so vast that having some kind of understanding about them and their meaning is also important. Like I hate people who go around spouting off things they don't mean or don't have a clue about what they mean, but are only trying to sound intelligent....
P.S. Welcome back NB, its nice to see you again.
Edited by Cyndi 2006-08-30 5:58 PM
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 2479
Location: A Blue State | Hello Neel, I am curious to know more about Prashantji's book on Trikonasana. He has apparently been teaching Trikonasana maniacally of late, with classes that are overwhelmed by repeated Trikonasanas. What is behind this? Trikonasana is a rich asana, with much to explore and also rather difficult to properly master. Does he have a vision of this pose? And Hello All, I have found it useful to work on the Sutras both in Sanskrit and in meaning. Since I really don't understand the Sanskrit, memorization of it serves in part as a mental discipline and in part as mnemonic for the meaning. And straight translation of the Sanskrit doesn't help me much -- I really prefer to read and compare commentaries, with contextual literature to help (inlcuding those texts that Cyndiji mentioned, among others). .... bg |
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| Here's a good site if you're interested in looking at translations side by side:
http://www.bindu.freeserve.co.uk/yoga/yogasutra/ys1_comments.htm#sutra1.1
He lists 8 different translations side by side for each sutra. |
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| Hello BG:
I am not the perfect person to comment on Prashant's Trikonasana book. Also, I have not been to his class since 1986 when I studied with him. But, basically, he has taken Trikonasana as one example, so as to say what he wants to about all Asanas. With Trikonasana as example, he has shown how the practice of it can be taken from the gross level to more subtle levels. That is all I can say on it. May be Tourist shall give more input once she reads the book I mailed to her today. |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 8442
| I know that PRashant has been interested in trikonasana for a long time. It sems to be a quintessential Iyengar pose. I have a copy of a practice that I think he wrote where trikonasana is done between each pose. We did it once in class and it was very interesting. |
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The Sutras
