|
|
| I have read that Yogi Bhajan 'received' the kundalini exercises from a spirit after sitting in a cave. This sounds extemely bogus to me.
Then in Gurmukh's DVD, she says that kundalini yoga is the oldest form of yoga and that all other forms of yoga derive from it. I don't feel too inclined to take this very seriously given that she was a disciple of Yogi Bhajan.
Which is the truth? |
|
| |
|
Expert Yogi
Posts: 8442
    
| Welcome, Ian  I don't worry too much about how a teacher's knowledge is acquired as long as it proves to be good and true. Followers fo Swami Sivananda Radha do a Divine Light Invocation that she received in a vision. It is a lovely invocation and all the rest of her teachings were very solid, based on her own inner work and rooted in true yoga tradtition.
I would agree that believing everything you hear and blindly following any claims a teacher makes is probably foolish (check out the thread on siddhis) and maybe if a teacher or style seems too "woo-woo" for you, you should look into a different style or teacher. But I also suggest that one should not throw out the baby with the bathwater  |
|
| |
|
| Success is your proof. If it doesn't work, don't do it. |
|
| |
|
| Hi there and thanks for your welcome.
Well I must admit I find the Gurmukh DVD pretty amazing.
Change of topic here, but what is strange is that just the first section of Gurmukh's DVD has a better effect on me than the whole of Ravi Singh & Ana Brett's Kundalini Yoga for Beginners & Beyond even though the latter pretty much covers the same moves.
Edited by IanIan 2006-06-14 11:25 AM
|
|
| |
|
| Well Yoga Journal has a Kundali routine in their home practice section this month. And in America isn't that the ultimate declaration of yoga legitimacy??? 
Edited by MrD 2006-06-15 8:20 PM
|
|
| |
|
| Sat Nam!
If Gurumuk says on her DVD that Kundalini came before all yogas she is very wrong and Yogi Bhajan never said that. He repeted many times that Kundalini Yoga is about 4.000 thousand years old, and that the base of that is Hatha Yoga, and also a integration with Bhakti and Raja Yoga.
Kundalini Yoga was a "secrete" yoga, it was considerated so powerful that only mesters would teach them disciples. Then about 500 years ago it also began to be practsed by the Sikh warriors and archmans before battles. So many of the mesters were Sickh.
Yogi Bhajan's mester passed this technics to him and he decided to difuse that on the ocident. Many people in India became disapointed with him and also angry because he was sharing something "secreted".
But none of this really matter. It makes no difference in your practse and results. This is the Aquarian Age, a time to experience not to collecting informations. Let's prepare our selfs to that. Try it!
i studie Kundalini and Yogi Bhajan's teaching a lot and i never heard that he said that he had this "vison" of kundalini after meditating in cage. |
|
| |
|
| Siri Guru Dev K - 2006-06-15 10:58 PM
Sat Nam!
If Gurumuk says on her DVD that Kundalini came before all yogas she is very wrong and Yogi Bhajan never said that. He repeted many times that Kundalini Yoga is about 4.000 thousand years old, and that the base of that is Hatha Yoga, and also a integration with Bhakti and Raja Yoga.
Kundalini Yoga was a "secrete" yoga, it was considerated so powerful that only mesters would teach them disciples. Then about 500 years ago it also began to be practsed by the Sikh warriors and archmans before battles. So many of the mesters were Sickh.
Yogi Bhajan's mester passed this technics to him and he decided to difuse that on the ocident. Many people in India became disapointed with him and also angry because he was sharing something "secreted".
But none of this really matter. It makes no difference in your practse and results. This is the Aquarian Age, a time to experience not to collecting informations. Let's prepare our selfs to that. Try it!
i studie Kundalini and Yogi Bhajan's teaching a lot and i never heard that he said that he had this "vison" of kundalini after meditating in cage.
The idea that Kundalini Yoga and such was kept Secret is mis understood, mostly in the western wold, but also in the Indian world of today. It is not keeping secret, but it is giving only to a worth student. If the student is not prequalified, it does not create the results, creating a doubt whether such a thing exists. Examples: see the postings on this board with questions. Also, you shall find that even the most famous Kundalini Yoga style teachers of today can not claim that they have experienced results of Kundalini Yoga such as mystical powers. This is the result of giving knowledge to any and every without seeing the prequalification. The yogis 4000 years ago were not egotistics, powerhungry or fools to keep the knowledge secret. They knew what to give and what not to give. There is nothing achieved by opening that secret, except experiencing only a small portion of it. And, that is fine. |
|
| |
|
Expert Yogi
Posts: 8442
| That's a great explanation Neel. Not so long ago, ALL knowledge was passed on that way, east and west. No great cook gave away their best recipes to the masses - one student at a time and only if he proved worthy. Same with bricklayers, carpenters, musicians and everyone else. Sadly though, some gurus waited too long and recipes were lost or misjudged the student and had their work corrupted or through flood, fire, epidemic or whatever, all the lineage was wiped out. Now we are in the information age and believe in the democracy of knowledge. We all feel entitiled, for better or worse, to all information all the time. So yoga teachings have been spread far and wide. History will tell which system works best. |
|
| |
|
| Part of me believes that we have inherited knowledge, passed down in our DNA. Maybe that's where we get some sudden insights from? |
|
| |
|
| tourist - 2006-06-30 10:16 AM
That's a great explanation Neel. Not so long ago, ALL knowledge was passed on that way, east and west. No great cook gave away their best recipes to the masses - one student at a time and only if he proved worthy. Same with bricklayers, carpenters, musicians and everyone else. Sadly though, some gurus waited too long and recipes were lost or misjudged the student and had their work corrupted or through flood, fire, epidemic or whatever, all the lineage was wiped out. Now we are in the information age and believe in the democracy of knowledge. We all feel entitiled, for better or worse, to all information all the time. So yoga teachings have been spread far and wide. History will tell which system works best.
Thanks Sis Tourist. Even if the knowledge seems to be lost due to destruction of means such as houses, schools, books, etc, the real knowledge always exists because:
yadaa yadaa hi dharmasya glaanirbhavati bhaarat
abhyuththaanamadharmasya sambhavaami yuge yuge.. bhagavadgeeta..
whenever there is shortagein dharma, the incarnation of previously liberated soul takes place to give this knowledge to the deserving one.
Again, the real knowledge does not come by just spreding the secrets or from books information, it comes when it is realized by one self. Books and such only give pointers.
However, books and instruction have their own place in the scheme of things.
|
|
| |
|
Expert Yogi
Posts: 8442
| Yes - I have a quote somewhere, perhaps by Swami Rama, that says something to the effect that the teachings we are given are all just "hints and guesses" and the real truth must be learned by oneself with practice and dedication. |
|
| |
|
| kulkarnn - 2006-06-29 8:44 PM
The idea that Kundalini Yoga and such was kept Secret is mis understood, mostly in the western wold, but also in the Indian world of today. It is not keeping secret, but it is giving only to a worth student. Worthy student!
I find this particular discussion, Kundalini, fascinating!
[img]http://www.givnology.com/400/pyrslft.jpg[/img]
At one point I realized that there are 7 endocrine glands, just about where the chakras are, and boink, synchrodestiny! As a composer I have found some amazing syncs with the 7 notes of music scales and the seven chakras.
Very empowering to visualize red-orange-green-blue-indigo-violet with a music scale! Here is the musical scale with the raised 4th tone, perhaps it raises the heart chakra!
http://www.givnology.com/301/Success.mpg
Using "A" as the root, perhaps the more ancient "Minor Key" to associate, we get LA as in the 6th tone (do re me fa so LA...) synced, the 7 become: La Ti Do Re Mi Fa So - or La Si Do... These and other connections I explore, and demonstrate research in videos, songs, "Keyboard Table" and other designs here:
http://www.givnology.com/compose.htm
[img]http://www.givnology.com/400/practic4.jpg[/img]
Kalkarrn, I now "DE-SECRETIZE" this, not desecrating, but making it non-secretive! he he.. 
Love and light being, Teo Do (Re, Mi, Fa, Soul...) |
|
| |
|
| Gurmukh was my yogi when I lived in LA a few years ago and have been extremely hard pressed to find any other instuctor that can come close to her teachings and instruction. Not only does kundalini help one spiritually & emotionally, but I would take her class twice a week and was totally ripped. |
|
| |
|
| As much fun as it is to play with numbers:
There are six colors to the visible light spectrum (red, orange, yellow, green, blue and violet; indigo is not usually considered a separate color). These classifications only have to do with the appearance of color to the human eye. Dogs or bees, for example see color quite differently. These colors are not distinct, but are a continuous spectrum and how we divide them is arbitrary and a result of culture, taste and language.
The most common musical scale in Western music has 7 tones but there are many different scales: diatonic, chromatic, whole tone and quarter tone (Persian). Common non-seven tone scales include pentatonic (5) and hexatonic (6). Prehistoric music has 2, 3 and 4 tone scales and some jazz and "modern" music uses an octatonic ( scale.
The theory of seven chakras that most Westerners adhere to comes from the book entitled “The Serpent Power” written by Sir John Woodroffe (1865-1936), alias Arthur Avalon. There are also chakra systems that have 5 or 8 and as many as 22 separate chakras. Coupling the chakras with the colors of the light spectrum is an American "New Age" invention from the 1970's. Before then, there were colors associated with the chakras, but generally they were (top down) clear light, snow white, gold, smokey grey, red, moon color and yellow. The joining of the chakras with endocrine system functions is also a modern "New Age" concept and is not based on the actual functioning of the various endocrine glands.
Edited by jimg 2007-12-02 3:36 PM
|
|
| |
|
| while that is fascinating information (and this is a very, very old thread), i think that new things can be learned and added.
if a new thing can't be 'true' or 'real' then it would suffice to say that all of our modern nutritional knowledge about, say vitamin C, is completely "new age" bunk that has no value to anyone.
and yet, we don't say that.
i would assert that it is possible for a "new age" discovery to occur in the practice of yoga, and for that discovery to add to the base of knowledge and to move it forward.
for my own part, i have noticed a change in the functionality of my endocrine system over the past decade (i had an endocrine problem diagnosed then, was unable to treat it with modern medicine, and instead healed myself of the problem through concerted effort in nutritional study and application as well as yoga studies and application).
thus, i would be inclined to assert that, perhaps this "new age" and "american" knowledge might actually have some benefit. |
|
| |
|
| I was not making value judgements about "New Age", "American" or "modern". I was only presenting a bit of background on the subject. I am hopeful that people everywhere are discovering new and important things all the time, in their yoga and in all their other pursuits.
If we are looking back to find "truth" from the past, it is getting further away from us with each moment. "Truth" can only exist right here, right now. |
|
| |
|
| i see.
that's basically the way that i see it. we can look to the past for information, for guidance--i think tradition is important--but it's important to also recognize what is here and now, what is different and developing, and have hope that even more will be known in the future. |
|
| |
|
| This can't be judged "legit or not" by the way they say it was received. Ancient yogis were known to spontaneously move into asanas. This isn't much different. Both were received by inspiration, albeit in a slightly different manner. Your best bet is, 1. ask around - find people who do it regularly and hear their testimonials and 2. try it yourself. But most importantly, educate yourself more deeply about it.
Edited by Sramani 2007-12-06 2:00 AM
|
|
| |
|
| Fantastic answer. Thank you.
Sramani - 2007-12-06 2:00 AM
This can't be judged "legit or not" by the way they say it was received. Ancient yogis were known to spontaneously move into asanas. This isn't much different. Both were received by inspiration, albeit in a slightly different manner. Your best bet is, 1. ask around - find people who do it regularly and hear their testimonials and 2. try it yourself. But most importantly, educate yourself more deeply about it. |
|
| |
|
| The fascinating thing is that Yogi Bhajan's teacher has never been located.
It's as if........... he made it up himself.
 |
|
| |
|
| Tourist-
Have you been to the Yasodhara Ashram? Or know anyone who has. It seems like a wonderful place.
|
|
| |
|
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 574
| Does it really matter? |
|
| |
|
Member
Posts: 16
| As Gurmukh says,'the jewel in the crown'
Respect and use the force, i.e Kundalini, wisely
lol..
http://www.yogibhajan.com/YBVideos.htm
Enjoy
Maharaja Ganj
------
Edited by Maharaja Ganj 2010-05-15 10:30 AM
|
|
| |
|
Member
Posts: 16
| IanIan - 2006-06-14 9:33 AM
I have read that Yogi Bhajan 'received' the kundalini exercises from a spirit after sitting in a cave. This sounds extemely bogus to me.
Then in Gurmukh's DVD, she says that kundalini yoga is the oldest form of yoga and that all other forms of yoga derive from it. I don't feel too inclined to take this very seriously given that she was a disciple of Yogi Bhajan.
Which is the truth?
Is say kundlaini yoga older than hatha yoga?
OBviously there's just broadish labels.
I could'nt really say.Though it would'nt surpise me. And obviously kundalini yoga is much older than yogi Bhajan for it could be thought of as a blanket umbrella term for a whole number of yogas designed to be good at awakening kundalini using specific levers and triggers for that end..Asana & pranayama can awaken kundalini but without meditation or an appreciation of the interconnectedness of all 8 limbs it could be haphazard approach.. Medtiation staabilisess and helps cultivates the witness observer state so the subtle energies flow.
Your first paragraph does'nt soound bogus. It is possible though i think it's equally possible he had a number of skih or indian teachers who passed perhaps some of it on. His style because that's what it is of kundalini yoga does appear quite distinctive. If he was master at 16 or 21 or whatever it is i am guessing he had teachers before him that he learnt from or perhaps was inlfuenced by.
You need a scholar and preferably a yogi to give the possible origins of his style of yoga a decent look if it has'nt been done already.
I have heard the the HYP described as a manual for awakening kundalini.But this can more properly be defined as hatha yoga.Rather than kundalini the term usualy implies you are more specifically working consciously or directly internal processes. Uusally we think of hatha yoga as without mediation but they can usefully be thought of as branches or as part of a tree.
Edited by Maharaja Ganj 2011-02-27 5:00 PM
|
|
| |
Is Kundalini yoga legit?
