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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 517
Location: New Jersey | I am making yet another attempt to go vegetarian, and I hope this time it will stick! Has anybody here had trouble staying vegetarian, and how did you overcome it? (if you did) My problem is that my fiance is Filipino(from what I've been able to observe, and very non-vegetarian culture), and when I go to family events, there is nothing I can really eat, and I feel bad always saying no. Another problem is that sometimes I just really really want a burger How do I get over this craving? Thanks! Samantha |
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| A better question might be, Is Vegetarianism for you? Sounds like you keep going back for some reason, maybe because your body needs meat. If you're not meeting your needs with a veggie diet, then you're probably going to develop cravings, which will make things hard for you. |
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| I have enough issues with proper nutrition (I'm gluten and dairy intolerant, have to moderate how much soy I have, and get hypoglycemic episodes) that I cannot successfully go vegetarian without it being clearly bad for me. So, while I would like to be able to, it's not a reality for me. Instead, I opt to make smarter meat choices (free-range, organic, small farm meats) and cut down on the amount of meat I consume. |
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| first, the above two posters make a very good point. vegetarianism--as a consistant dietary practice for ethical reasons, as a spiritual discipline, etc--may not be for everyone. occassional vegetarianism--for health (cleansing), spiritual discipline, etc, might be a good option as a concept of 'practicing'--know what i'm trying to convey? anyway. . .
saying all of that, i'm a vegetarian. i was vegan for a time, but due to specific health concerns, i am now ovo-lacto even though i still continue to eschew animal products in other aspects of my life such as choosing shampoos and shoes and what have you.
i find vegetarianism to be fun, fulfilling and simple. but, i had to be clear about my reasons for becoming vegetarian, and sure in myself, before i was able to make it 'stick.' early on, my failures at vegetarianism were largely due to social reasons. i often felt 'different' or 'ostracized' socially, and i thought that another element of that--vegetarianism--another element of difference would make things even more difficult. i often tried to 'become vegetarian' with someone else who was not interested or committed to it--like a friend or my husband. and when they decided no longer to be vegetarian--usually the second day or so--then i also decided not to be vegetarian, in order to fit in.
once i decided, though, that i wanted to be vegetarian and i clearly understood the reasoning behind it, becoming vegetarian and dealing with the subsequent social issues wasn't terribly difficult. But, i did take my time in transitioning.
it is important, i think, to talk about transitioning. I decided to become vegetarian--for a variety of reasons--but gave myself the statement "only so long as it is healthy for me." i spent six months doing research on vegetarian nutrition while consistantly moving away from animal products (starting with meat). I would have meat once or twice a week during this time, which eventually became once a month. I had meat once a month for a couple of months because of social reasons. I didn't want to 'come out' to my parents (who were anti-veg), and my relationship with my in laws was always shakey. i decided that when i went to their house, i would eat what they served--even meat--and if i could avoid it, i would.
The last time i had meat, it was 1/2 of a chicken breast at my father in law's birthday party in January of 2000. After eating this, i had a severe stomach ache--which was psychosomatic, i believe. i was in a state of 'cognative dissonance' which is doing something against your own conscious or logical thought processes. my mind said "i don't want to eat meat" but my fear said "eat meat so that your brief visit with your in laws won't have any problems" and then my body-mind went and got upset over it. And my in laws then saw that--and the early excuse became "well, meat makes her sick." and so it's acceptable to them.
it is important to mention that my husband is omnivorous, as is all of my extended family and most of my friends. I live in a predominently omnivorous world, really, and i find vegetarianism fun and fulfilling emotionally and otherwise. I'm very healthy and strong and i rarely get sick. I feel very blessed that i can be vegetarian.
And people ask me 'don't you want X?" and here's what i've found. Generally, i don't actually want the burger, i want the emotional feeling connected to having a burger. This time of year, a lot of people start their BBQ-ing. Lots of burgers on the grill, you know? i walk around and think "wow, that smells great." the smell reminds me of being a kid, of softball games and practices, of long summer days at the pool, and coming home to my parents where we would sit on the patio and have a great dinner together--hamburgers, steaks, potato salad, and all that. It gives me a feeling of happiness--and the burger is, in a way, symbolic of that.
But i know that i don't want to eat a hamburger, a dead cow. I just know that i don't. What i do want is the feeling of summer, being with my family, having a great meal. I can do that without having a burger. I make my own home-made black bean patties, which we grill (separate from the meat, on tin foil so that no meat gets on it), and i sit down on the patio and have a great summer meal with my family, or watch a ball game or whatever else.
so, sometimes you hve to wonder--do i want the food or do i want the feelings and experiences that i associate with this food? And when you realize the difference, you know how to act. |
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| hi samatha- i've been going through similar transition! i've been adding fish to my diet for the last 2 years and have really enjoyed how that made me feel- but by now i've collected enough information on vegetarian nutrition ( and recipies I love!) to know that i'm ready to make the switch back to an ovo-lacto diet. this comes after a winter with meat cravings so strong, I though about abandoning vegeratianism altogether! what's been happening is- i found that as I paid closer attention to my diet, increased the frequency of my asana practice, began meditation, and the weather warmed up, those strong cravings have really just dissapated. ( whew!) I've also been reading up on the historical/philosophical roots of yoga, which has been really inspiring in terms of pushing me to go for the lifestyle I really want to have.
Also, I 've been to a few potlucks recently with other veggies & "flexitarians" which is also inspiring- and you get loads of great food and food ideas without having to cook much. I really need that kind of community support every once in a while-especially around family holiday time! can you do something similar where you are?
oh, and i wouldn't feel too bad saying no to certain foods-we all turn down foods we don't like, are allergic to or don't make us feel good. this is a similar situation, IMHO. you might bring something to share to those gatherings that you can eat, or volunteer to help cook or set up, then throw some dishes you can eat into the menu. it's a subtle way to share recipies with your omnivore family too. in my fam, before i started doing that, they just didn't know what the heck to make for me to eat!
Edited by sirensong2 2006-04-14 11:54 PM
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| great point about the emotional component of food. It's really very powerful stuff, that. I 've been doing a lot of that kind of self analysis when i think about why i craved meat so much this winter. my cravings really started around late november when i started making arrangements to visit the fam for the holidays... |
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| I wanted to add... don't let fear of letting your friends know that you want to stick to being vegetarian get in the way. A friend of mine is vegetarian, but she doesn't like to be a bother when at others houses for dinner. Having my food issues though, I *enjoy* making sure that everyone's significant dietary choices are respected, so it's a pleasure to make sure that we have a tasty, vegetarian meal for her. (And I don't mean 'option', I mean full meal. I hate the 'well, the mashed potatoes and green beans are vegetarian' approach. That's not a meal!!) Your friends may be very supportive of you and may help you maintain that commitment, when you're afraid of it being the other way 'round. |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 5098
 
Location: Somewhere in the Mountains of Western NC | In YJ this month there is a great article regarding the Vegetarian issue. In the back there is an interview with Ana Forest that talks about this as well. I highly suggest you read this article, it is wonderful. Good luck |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 517
Location: New Jersey | Thanks everyone! I definitely want to continue to try to be vegetarian, but I know it is going to take some effort. Maybe that's why I've failed in the past. I just didn't put in enough effort. Zoebird: That's a good point you made about the emotional attachement to food. At barbeques or family events, I definitely feel the craving for the food I've always associated with those events. I'm going to try to constantly remind myself when I'm in those situations that I don't really want the food I'm craving, I just have a memory attached to it. Samantha |
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| oh yeah! that article was pretty cool- it was a little surprising to find out mrs. forrest is a hunter, but you know, somehow, it just fits her. she's kinda like zena yoga warrior princess. definite good read. |
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| it's a funny thing, but i'm not against hunting either. actually, if i had both the skills and the time, i would prefer to hunt for my husband's food, rather than buy it at the health food store and off the farm. it's these things that make meat convenient, but takes us out of the larger picture--i think--of our dependence on animals.
when i was younger (a young teen), i had these dreams (day) about living on a small farm with my own goats (milk/cheese) and chickens and ducks (eggs, meat), growing my own large organic garden (fruits, vegetables, nuts, seeds, some grains, beans, and herbs--cooking and medicinal), and hunting and fishing for food. Even then, i wanted to be vegetarian, but i didn't think/feel that it was for everyone and that for those in my home who would want to eat meat, that this is the best way to get it (grow it or hunt it).
a lot of people think that's very non-vegetarian of me, or that i'm somehow not a 'real vegetarian'--but i'm not vegetarian because i oppose killing animals for food. killing animals for food can be completely appropriate--it's the reason and the mechanisms that are important. |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 475
Location: canada | i was thinking about going 100% veg again; i'm at 75% or so now. before i hated the beans but now my body is accepting it and i don't get that full "undigested" feeling anymore..i think my digestive system is functioning better these days. i just can't seem to give up chicken..  its a cultural thing for me.
as far as the protein issue goes, i use "any-whey" which is a protein powder you can mix into food easier than other powders out there...and i still like chicken... |
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| Samantha,
you wrote: |My problem is that my fiance is Filipino(from what I've been able to observe, and very non-vegetarian culture), and when I go to family events, there is nothing I can really eat, and I feel bad always saying no. |
BOY do I relate to THAT one! I think that is an important part of the transition phase as well. It is not just you getting your body and mind prepared for vegitarianism, it is getting your social network to absorb the idea...it takes time. Be gentle with yourself and with your friends and family. OTOH, I look at the social pressure aspect of it as an opportunity. It is a great chance for me to practice balancing my compassion and understanding for others with asserting myself (for me an effort...I am easy-going). I also try very hard to fine tune my responses to different scenarios so that I am not skirting the issue, getting on a vegetarianism soap box, belittling others choices or absolute right to disagree with me, or preaching in any way. It is also an art form of sorts to make your omnivorous friends comfortable around you as well. As was mentioned, I usually make some dishes to take to group gatherings. (I put a lot of effort into this and occassionally...my meat and potato friends have been piling second helpings of tofu on their plate).
Sometimes you might have to "cave" socially. I did that a while back while at dinner at my boss' house. He went to all of the trouble to make a veg entree (cheese ravioli) and cook the chicken on the side for everyone else and then place the chicken on top of the pasta for the others. When he got to me, he just couldn't stand it and threw 2 strips on my plate insisting that I just HAD to try his chicken. I was gracious and tried the chicken. It was DELICIOUS (which is not the point) and I ate every bite. I complemented his cooking prowess (which is formidable) and everyone started teasing me (quite harshly) that I was a poor excuse for a vegetarian for scarfing down that chicken. They commented that it was a good thing I have friends like them because obviously my body needs meat. I just smiled politely and said, "perhaps you are right. Perhaps I am a poor excuse for a vegetarian, and the meal was certainly delicious. I do my very best to avoid eating meat because I do not want an innocent animal to have to give it's life to nourish me when I am so blessed with other options. I would probably tear into some flesh if I were starving to death and it was my only option. But please never ask me to frivolessly waste meat that is given to me. That animal made the ultimate (unwilling) sacrifice and I will honor that animal the best I am able." No one in that group has EVER EVER tried to push meat on me since. When they clearly saw that it was a spiritual and emotional struggle and that I was expending great energy to be compassionate to THEIR beliefs, they lost their appetite for prodding me.
If vegetarianism is the right choice for you, then it is a VERY fulfilling thing. Most worthwhile things in life do not come easily. Please do not allow the need for control and perfection of your diet cloud the meaning behind it. Good Luck. |
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| Dear Samantha77:
This is what I have to say in terms of your original question (please read the question again):
1. Your main yoga practice is to find a way to NOT feel bad to say NO to eating non vegetarian.
2. Another practice for you is to develop a mental practice (which is the real Yoga Practice. Here Poses will NOT help you as many circles think!) where Burger can be eaten without meat!
3. It is NOT that your Fiance is a problem. Fiance is an event. And, the problem is your own mind. You have to train your mind so that a) you can do 1 above b) do 2 above and c) communicate with Fiance and others about your decisions and feelings. and d) Lastly, choose both Fiance+Vegetarianism or Choose Fiance OR Vegetarianism as your Heart Tells You , OR lead a life of slavery by yielding in to saying YES while you continue to feel bad about being NON VEGETARIAN.
4. As for Nutrition, there is NO problem with Vegetarianism. And, there is nothing NON Vegetarian you need to get proper nutrition.
Best Luck |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 517
Location: New Jersey | Thanks for the advice everyone! I've been doing pretty well so far. I did cave a little this past Sunday (Greek Easter) but other than that I've been experimenting alot with cooking different foods. My fiance's family isn't a problem, it's more that I feel bad that everytime I go there I can't really eat anything. The last time I was there, someone had said that she was going to make sure that there would be something for me to eat the next time I came over. Which made me feel bad also because I don't want them to feel like they have to go out of their way for me! Samantha |
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| Just another quick point,
For anyone considering modifying their diet to exclude foods, make sure that you are not doing so out of a need to restrict yourself in an eating disordered way. Our minds may tell us that we are modifying our diet for social/environmental/ethical reasons (all valid) yet our real motivator may be to restrict nourishment to our bodies.
Please don't think I am referring to all vegetarians or vegans. Just be mindful of your motivations. |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 8442
 
| I think this is an excellent point, bigmamma. I know a few people who believe food is the main cause of their every ill (I am not saying it is not a contributing factor, just that these individual seem to feel it is the only factor they can control) and restrict their diets more and more with every symptom. One in particular never seems to be able to add that food back into her diet in even the tiniest way without wildly difficult "reactions." Again, this is possible I suppose, but this person is also very obssessed with body weight and appearance and I think the perceived "allergies" are simply an excuse for an eating disorder. Funny thing is, this is a person who has done a lot of therapy and personal growth type of work and thinks she has a pretty good handle on her life, but from the outside, it looks a bit scary... |
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| tourist:
ken wilber (transpersonal psychology/philosophy) writes about this phenominon actually. a person can be very advanced in some areas of their lifes (such as a very advanced yogin) but then be completely backward in other aspects (the yogin is also an extreme alcoholic). a person can be deeply aware and have worked through *these* issues, but can't even see *those* issues. You know?
Mommy:
it is true that some people restrict because of eating disorders and a person should go into any dietary change with a sense of clarity and purpose--and not for twisted reasons. it's sad really, but a lot of veggies do have eating disorders because it is an easy way to be 'righteously restricted.' if an anorexic is asked at the BBQ why he isn't eating, he can say "i'm vegan! eating meat is murder!' as opposed to acknowledgeing "i have a disease called anorexia, and i'm currently not doing anything about it.'
to this, i had an experience at the gym the other day. the whole gym has been talking about this one young woman who is obviously anorexic. everyone mentioned it to me--i'd never seen or met her. I happened to see her on friday, and recognized it. During her work out, most people told her 'you don't need to loose weight." which to an anorexic's mind usually translates to "weight is so important; i need to stay vigilant so that i don't get overweight and become unattractive"--so it perpetuates the cycle. Finally, i was in the locker room alone with her and she was looking in the mirror and making faces of disgust at herself. I said "What you're experiencing is called body dismorphia. It's a symptom of anorexia." she was shocked, but i called her out.
it was a compassionate act. She went crying to her mother who said "that woman says i'm anorexic" and her mother said "thank god, we've been so worried. now we can get you help!" mom was liberated to call it out and get her help. I recommended a few specialists in the area--and alls well that ends well. Or begins well, as it is. I figured, someone's gotta give this a name so that we can all start working with it, rather than being uncomfortable and trying to ignore her suffering for goodness sake. |
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| zoebird - 2006-04-27 12:23 PM
tourist:
ken wilber (transpersonal psychology/philosophy) writes about this phenominon actually. a person can be very advanced in some areas of their lifes (such as a very advanced yogin) but then be completely backward in other aspects (the yogin is also an extreme alcoholic). a person can be deeply aware and have worked through *these* issues, but can't even see *those* issues. You know?
Jack Kornfield talks about this a little as well. His experience was of being a monk at a monestary for years. When he got out he was like a complete alien in our culture. He could gain advanced stages of meditation, but was unable to operate a car, or ask women out on dates.
Anyway, I think in some cases that you can use advances in some areas to help in other. For example, by gaining better understanding of your own mental processes via mediation, you gain a better understanding of the people around you.
BTW, good for you ZB, I'm always pretty cautious about calling people out, it's a dangerous act to get involved in, particular without knowing all aspects of the situation. So I try to be very mindful when I find myself in a similar situation. |
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| i try to be mindful too. this situation seemed like the right time and place to do it. i wasn't in front of anyone else. she could have passed it off completely and just been mad at me (and i'm a stranger, so what does it matter?)
sure, i didn't/don't know the whole situation, but i knew enough, and felt the right spiritual/intuitive push to act, and so i did. |
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| Not criticizing, quite the opposite. I often find I hesitate when I should act. |
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| Zoebird,
Right on for having the courage to be honest. The women I work with really struggle with feeling the world is hypocritical so your acting honestly will probably be very important to that young woman down the road.
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| From what you've said, it sounds to me like you aren't very confident in your reasons for becoming vegetarian. I've been vegan since 1984, and never looked back. My wife, who is on-and-off vegan for almost the same period, worries about how to behave in certain social situations so that her diet doesn't put someone else at a disadvantage. What it comes down to is that I eat only what I want to eat, it happens to be vegan, and I don't care what anyone thinks or has to say on the subject. If vegan food is unavailable, I go hungry, but I don't mind.
If you are concerned about what to eat when vegan fare isn't offered, or whether it will be healthy to eat vegan/vegetarian food exclusively, then you may not have the confidence you need to resist temptations from the people around you. It just so happens that I am convinced that a vegan diet is healthier and more humane than any other, but if I actually liked animal foods, I'd eat them. Why don't I like them? Could it be that I'm listening to my body? I'd like to think so.
When I became a vegan, it was within months of leaving home and being faced with food purchasing choices for the first time. Without someone else buying meat, etc, it never occured to me to do it on my own. I didn't know this meant I was "vegetarian" or "vegan" until two years later when I was traveling in Europe and heard the word "vegan" for the first time.
As for health, I should point out that prior to becoming vegan, I was not in good health. I got sick frequently, and had a hard time climbing stairs and other types of physical activity, despite being a teenager. After becoming a vegan, I became very active physically. See the proof in my extreme yoga poses, from my site: http://www.paqart.com/Yoga/fulPigeon.html .
I probably sound harsh here, so I'd like to wind up on a positive note: I have discovered that most people leave me alone about my diet once I make it clear that this decision is one that I will never waver on. Furthermore, most people are willing to accomodate me, in those situations where it is practical to do so. I have seen these very same people treat other vegans/vegetarians very differently, if they sense any wavering in their commitment. |
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Going Vegetarian
