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| Self study time, boys and girls! 
Specifically, how do you practice your yamas and niyamas? anything creative?
Has this changed since you started practicing ?
Do you seek out ways or are you just more aware of your actions?
Stories, Thoughts, Epiphanies (sp?) I promise I will post mine when i get back from class!
Prem&Om, Anya
Mod: please move if this is in the wrong spot.
Edited by anya sharvani 2005-08-08 4:19 PM
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|  I thought this was going to be a good one!
Aparigraha/Santosha: I always did volenteer work for animal shelters(my passion) but have started to give some time now to causes that I am not so comfortable with...working with elderly nursing home residents. Also: I used to want more more more...I activily try to live as simply as possible.
Ahimsa: being a vegetarian, using green products and recycling
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| I am ashamed to admit that I have to look up what they are before I can reply.
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| i've been doing a lot of work with brahmacharya recently. the term means "walking with God' or "eyes on God" (specifically as denoted by brahma). It often refers to celebacy or sexual ethics (for householders, etc). But, i'm looking at it in that broader concept of balance in life through 'walking with God.' one of my friends calls it 'dancing with the divine' but i consider that more of a shakti thing.  |
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| I have also heard brahmacharya described as conscious use of energy. In that aspect, I try to focus my energy on things that improve my knowledge (like being on this forum rather than plying video games  )
I am also more open with my spiritual beliefs. I give thanks before meals in public, and spend time outside at my outdoor altar each day. |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 8442
    
| Aparigraha - non-hoarding, clearing out stuff. This changes from time totime. I think I have had to do at least two or three training papers about it at different times. |
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| I've been giving a lot of thought to non-harming and truthfulness, which is part of the reason why I posted the "What Yogis Can't Say" thread. However, to be honest, this balancing of non-harming and truthfullness and achieving my own ends is always somewhere in my mind.
I also find that mediation helps. No matter what the other results, it fills the time I could be getting into trouble.
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| GreenJello - 2005-08-09 9:56 PM
I've been giving a lot of thought to non-harming and truthfulness, which is part of the reason why I posted the "What Yogis Can't Say" thread. However, to be honest, this balancing of non-harming and truthfullness and achieving my own ends is always somewhere in my mind. I also find that mediation helps. No matter what the other results, it fills the time I could be getting into trouble.
I always was an honest person. It took a long time for me to be honest in a loving, gentle way. sometimes brutal honesty is needed, but I really try to look at the situation first before I speak.
Here's some honesty: GJ, I have a feeling nothing keeps you out of trouble! |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 5098
Location: Somewhere in the Mountains of Western NC | zoebird - 2005-08-09 4:10 PM
i've been doing a lot of work with brahmacharya recently. the term means "walking with God' or "eyes on God" (specifically as denoted by brahma ). It often refers to celebacy or sexual ethics (for householders, etc ). But, i'm looking at it in that broader concept of balance in life through 'walking with God.' one of my friends calls it 'dancing with the divine' but i consider that more of a shakti thing.
Sorry Zoebird,
Traditionally, Brahmacharya is not meant for householders..it is meant for students at the student age. Like I wish modern teenagers would get this!!!! It is also a form of practice when you are practicing monkhood or when you are living the single life, unmarried. If you are a householder you are not suppose to be practicing this, you are suppose to be practicing kama sutra and making babies,  |
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| it is my understanding that brahmacharya includes the scriptures of the kama sutra. it doesn't necessarily refer to celebacy for young people, single people, or monks, but that may be an aspect of it.
also, since i'm taking a 'broader approach' to the term, 'walking with God,' i think it's appropriate to take on the concept of moderation and moving from the spirit in all actions (walking with God in all actions) as an aspect of study.
on a similar note, it isn't appropriate for me to 'make a baby' right now. my husband and i do not have the approprate funds to care for a child at this time. when we do, we'll have a child. until such time, we practice FAM as a method of birth control/family planning. this includes abstinance during my fertile time of the month. This is also an aspect of practicing brahmacharya in my opinion.
according to the teachers at the local hindu temple and that the gurukalam, this is an appropriate study, consideration, and practice of brahmacharya. Similarly, i was under the understanding that Ghandi, a householder, and his wife practiced brahmacharya in their later years. i do not know if this is absolutely true, only something that i heard through a reputable source. |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 5098
Location: Somewhere in the Mountains of Western NC | Zoebird,
According to Vedanta, Grihastha (Householder) Ashrama is the backbone of society. Grihastha Ashrama is a field for very intense austerity towards spiritual advancement. It depends upon the angle of vision: Once you change the angle from Bhoga to Moksha - from sense-pleasure to liberation - your life becomes a stream of prayer and austerity that will lead you to the highest. Having that said, all those who belong to the other Ashramas (orders of society) - Brahmacharya (students), Vanaprastha (those who are retired), and Sanyasa (those who have taken to the order of renunciation) - depend upon the householders.
If householders are not well-disciplined, society will not have disciplined students; it will not have mature aged people who can guide others and there will be no spiritual teachers. Therefore the responsibility of Grihastha Ashrama is of immense importance.
After completing Grihastha Ashrama (householder stage), one performs a special samskara for entering Vanaprastha Ashrama (stage of austerity and reflection). After this stage, ideally, one performs a special spiritual rite to enter Sanyasa (order of renunciation) and devotes the balance of his life to pursuing the path to enlightenment and sharing his knowledge with humanity.
Brahmacharya is the first stage of life. In this student stage one learns to live a life of austerity and discipline which lays down the foundation for future success in life.
In a restricted sense, brahmacharya implies abstaining from sex pleasures. In a wider sense, brahmacharya is a plan of total disciplining of the body, mind and senses for receiving education, and for moving towards the final goal - Brahman or God-realization.
Hope that will helps.
Cyndi
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| cyndi:
it is very informative, thank you.
since brahmacharya is included as one of the yama/niyama in most literature, i have asked in light of similar information to what you have given, why the term 'brahmacharya' is used when it appears to only refer to one stage of life.
the answer that i was given was that it generally refers to sexual conduct--throughout life--and includes these different elements depending upon where one is in those stages. It is appropriate for a householder to practice yoga, to practice yamas and niyamas, and in this practice their 'right form' of 'brahmacharya'--which for householders includes having children, working diligently to support the community, etc. To see 'brahmacharya' in this sense is to have a broader perspective of social/sexual ethics and how each phase of life or circumstance calls for a different perspective.
each perspective hinges on the concept of looking toward the deeper spiritual practices that underpin our common activities and life cycle. this calls for that looking inward--or walking with God (or eyes on God, both of which are translations of the word 'Brahma-' and '-charya')--as opposed to the 'bhoga' process of seeking sensory pleasure (regardless of whether that pleasure is sexual or not. . .because all of the senses are used in sexuality, but there are other sensory pleasures that can be used in other ways, outside of sexuality).
this is how i'm engaging the idea. |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 5098
Location: Somewhere in the Mountains of Western NC | Zoey,
I was giving you the Traditional interpretation of what Brahmacharya means from an Hindu/Indian perspective. When you say that Householders can practice Brahmacharya, that does not make sense. However, when you say householders should practice austerity and discipline with right sexual conduct, that makes more sense.
Marriage in Hindu Dharma was not designed to give license to the instinctive pleasure urge that abides in every human being. All living beings have the biological urge of procreation, but as a human being you have the capacity and possibility of attaining liberation. Keeping this in view, the Vedic culture gives a direction and meaning to the sex-urge through the sacrement of Vivaha. (Vivaha is one of the Samskaras which literally means impressions, but they also refer to special rituals or sacrements which create positive impressions (shubha samskaras) in the mind.) These samskaras are purificatory rites; they spiritualize the special events of one's life from the time of conception to the time of one's death and the cremation of the body. (Sorry, I know that is waaaayyy too much information, but I wanted you to get the idea.)
It should be understood that sexual intimacy between husband and wife becomes a source of greater pleasure when it is viewed as a means to the unfoldment of deeper love -- a love that brings unity of the mind, the heart and the soul.
Edited by Cyndi 2005-08-11 10:05 AM
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| yes, and i understand that.
i also understand that when i asked my teachers regarding these issues--and why the term brahmacharya was used in the yama/niyama descriptions of the philosophical underpinnings of yoga as it is taught in the west, they said basicly what you said. which is basicly what i was saying. and therefore, i'm focusing on the yama/niyama of brahmacharya at this time. |
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Hmm... Flattery will get you nowhere. In all seriousness, I'm a pretty boring person, so I've been attempting to cultivate my more mischievious side. Sometimes it works, sometimes not.
I've been enjoying the discussion on brachya. One of the first books I read was I.K Taimni's "The Science of Yoga", and he's pretty much "No Sex, ever, forget about it!" (Did I mention the no sex part?) Anyway, his interpretation is so strict that I practically gave up the whole practice right there. However, I thought about it for a while, and decided he was off his rocker. Personally, I think this sort of religious extremism is part of whats wrong with the world, but what I do I know? (I'm probably a leftie, and don't even know it....) Oh well, bring on the beer and wenches!
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 8442
| I'm a pretty boring person, so I've been attempting to cultivate my more mischievious side. Sometimes it works, sometimes not.
Its working just fine here - keep up the good work!
As for celibacy, it is not for "householder yogis" although, as someone said, older yogi couples in India sometimes do adopt the practice. There is a story in Autobiography of a Yogi about it. |
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| I think that all the yamas and niyamas can be open to different interpretations, and each person should use them as a guide based on his or her own beliefs.It's not to make you feel guilty or bad about yourself, IMO, but to cultivate awareness. For instance, for some, bramacharya is no sex. for others, it may be forgoing sex at some times to prevent pregnancy, or for some single people, it would be being mindful of insuring that sex is for the sake of pleasure for both parties, safe, and without conditions or false promises.(so you CAN bring on the wenches, just so you are aware not to tell them you have 24 hours to live so they sleep with you: )) Anya |
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| there was a great yoga journal article about expanding brahmacharya out to refer to sexual ethics and how it applies to the different phases of life and relationships. i think the artile is about two or three years old now, but it was really fascinating.
as cyndi said, in certain circles, brahmacharya speaks spefically to the practice of celebacy. But, not everyone is called to this lifestyle choice throughout their lives. So, how does one practice 'brahmacharya' in another phase of life or circumstance?
this is why many yogins have turned the idea on it's side a bit and looked to the broad spectrum of teachings on sexual conduct and behavoir throughout life. expanding brahmacharya to refer to a philosophical process based on the 'bare bones' sort of translation of the term as well as using mindfulness to direct one's actions, one sees a cohesive system of sexual ethics based on human and societal needs. Turning inward to act from a place of peace, nonviolence, nonstealing, etc in regards to sex, an individual treats himself/herself with honor, dignity and grace in all social and sexual interactions.
This is not to say that it must 'look like this' or 'be like that'--but that there is a deeply personal aspect to the whole process that rests in strong self reflection. traditionally, homosexuality is frowned upon. yet in the west, homosexuality is considered a valid, healthy sexuality for some or many individuals. traditionally, polyamory is practiced (there are many polyamorous aspects written about in the kama sutra--how to manage concubines and multiple wives). Yet in the west, polyamory is generally frowned upon. For some people, polyamory may function as a healthy, normal sexuality. Each of these sexualities or sexual preferences and activities requires a great deal of mindfulness about one's self and how one interacts with others.
sex is meant to be a deeply creative, bonding, loving act. Often, it is an act for pleasure that uses another person as an object of recieving that pleasure. To me, this act is often violent, it's stealing, etc--so the other yamas/niyamas do come into play in this picture as well--as far as how to think about one's sex life and what the process is.
as yogins, as citizens of the world, it is our responsibility to turn inward, to determine what is right and best for us and for those around us with whom we associate--and how we associate with them. this is a larger practice of mindfulness that cultivates a deep awareness of moving from the spirit in all of our interactions with others.
in the modern world, where so much is generally considered 'ok' people often take the approach that it is then, specifically ok. it may not be. it may be appropriate for one person to have two husbands, but for another person to only have one. It may be appropriate for one person to have an active, polyamorous homosexual sex life, but another homosexual may be better served through celebacy until s/he finds an appropriate life partner. Each person's needs, abilities, and sexuality will take on a very different appearance.
So, in many ways, brahmacharya in the modern world, particularly the modern western world, is a broad spectrum of practices that hinges on that looking inward and 'walking with God.' |
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| zoebird - 2005-08-12 6:09 AM
sex is meant to be a deeply creative, bonding, loving act. Often, it is an act for pleasure that uses another person as an object of recieving that pleasure. To me, this act is often violent, it's stealing, etc--so the other yamas/niyamas do come into play in this picture as well--as far as how to think about one's sex life and what the process is.
I'll have to give this some thought. I've often wondered why **** is so often used in the violent/violation manner. It's very odd that a word that refers to something that should be very wonderful is considered to be one of the most offensive words in our language.
I had a friend a while back from Canada that claimed that people often swore by the things that frustrated them. In his case he had a serious problem with organized religion, so he'd often say 'tabernacle'. I wonder if this also doesn't feed back into the use of the word **** quite often.
A quick glance on TV will convince anybody that every body and their brother is having more sex with better looking partners than they'll ever experience. And that's the regular programming! The ads are much worse, often appealing to the most base instints possible, it's no wonder people have problems dealing with each other in a decent manner.
Frankly if there weren't a few programs worth watching, I'd junk the whole thing.
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 8442
| Ah yes, the Quebecker's nastiest curse word! I didn't know about that for a long time - too far west, I guess. Didn't George Carlin do a bit about why we use the "f" word as a curse? It has long puzzled me, as well. I actually rate people by the quality and variety of their curse words. If all you can come up with is "f" this and "f" that, I suggest expanding your repertoire. It is one of the reasons I don't like Hollywood movies much - no variety and always the one "f" bomb, as the kids are calling them these days, to ensure the PG rating and not sink into G movie hell. I mean, come on! Get some imagination going! Nothing like a good old fashioned "Jesus, Mary and Joseph" from a Newfie or my DD's fave when she was 12 or 13 "she's a witch with a capital B" perhaps my lifetime favourite "Christ on a bike!" |
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| chicken!
uhm, it started out as a slander, the f-word. some say it refers to an acronym--for unlawful carnak knowledge--and was used in the legal system as an acronym back in the middle ages. a person would use a woman or man for unlawful carnal knowledge and the aggreived husband or father could sue on these grounds and ask for reparations.
so, it's a curse because it deals with usery. it refers to sex when one person is using another. previously, it was 'unlawfully'--now, it's just any sort of usery. anyway, don't remember the source material, but this is what i recall. |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 5098
Location: Somewhere in the Mountains of Western NC | Actually, the "f" word came from the British. I used to have a detailed internet article referring to this. Something about the "pluck you" phrase is where it originated from. Any Bristish people out there familiar with this?? |
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| cyndi:
i'll look it up. slang dictionary online would probably help. |
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| here's a link:
seems you're right cyndi!
http://urbanlegends.about.com/library/bl-f-word.htm |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 5098
Location: Somewhere in the Mountains of Western NC | Yes, it was "Pluck Yew", with the finger. Actually, the folk story I was referring to was a story about a fox hunt or something, they were on horses and the guy held his finger and said "pluck yew". Ah, it's been a long time and I barely remember that and am probably totally wrong, but you get the jest of it, I got that story from an Englishman I knew from another internet forum |
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Yamas and Niyamas
