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| Are the 2 compatible? I have just started yoga as a way to be more at peace with myself. However I am a devout Christian. At first it bothered me a bit that there was a buddha idol in the studio(at least that is who i think it is, might just be some generic man for all I know), but then I thought you see those types of things in a lot of places and it's not like I am praying to it or anything. Whenever I bring it up to other Christians I know ( who do not practice yoga ), they tell me I am making a mountain out of a mole hill ( which I am very good at doing ). So i started to research it on the internet and found mixed results, most Christian sites being against it but some for it, some churches even offer yoga classes, so there is no consensus. My faith is very important to me and comes first in my life.
I would like anyones opinions on this and what you did or found out to bring yourself peace on this subject. Until I fully work this out, I will never be able to get the full benefits of yoga. Thanks in advance for any replies. | |
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| Run for the hills. Yoga is an acronym for (Y)ou will become (O)ne with the (G)lorious (A)nti-Christ. Get out while there is still time. You have been warned.
By the way, was it a samyaksambuddhas or pratyekabuddhas Buddha?
Edited by grasshopper 2007-04-12 5:28 PM
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| I read the bible, read it probably 10 times through and through
I was raised Christian and didn't miss a Sunday School or Sermon for 18 years
I went to college, learned about a lot of other ideas, began practicing yoga--starting doing some real thinking, then some meditation
Ultimately you must decide what your faith is, I'm glad you are reaching for the knowledge
we don't really know when it comes to faith, and belief, because if we knew then it wouldn't be faith or belief, now, would it?
Any sort of inflexible dogma that can not stand up to truth can not stand in a clear mind, so clear your mind
there you may see for yourself what is compatible and what is not
that is all
thank you, come again
Edited by SCThornley 2007-04-12 5:27 PM
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| sark - 2007-04-12 1:51 PM
I have just started yoga as a way to be more at peace with myself. However I am a devout Christian. At first it bothered me a bit that there was a buddha idol in the studio(at least that is who i think it is, might just be some generic man for all I know),
Can't say I understand how you could have ever been "bothered" by an image of who you thought was Buddha, especially if you weren't even aware of who/what you're looking at... but it's good that you're not "bothered" anymore.
It seems to me you had already answered your own question: You started yoga to be at peace with yourself...
You're not going to find an answer by doing an internet search. You need to look inside yourself. You already have the answers. I understand that your faith comes first... but this should also apply to having faith in yourself.
If you honestly think that christianity and yoga are incompatible or that yoga somehow makes you a bad christian, then maybe you shouldn't practice.
But it seems you've already come to your own conclusions about this...
which is why you are practicing in the first place, right?
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 8442
    
| The most religious person I know is a devout Catholic, though certainly by any description she would be called a liberal Catholic. She worked with Mother Teresa and washed the feet of diseased street people in India and saw (or at least tried really hard to see) the light of the Divine in them. She comes to my class, chants the OMs and invocation to Patanjali. She leaves in silence after the final OM to keep the Peace and Light within her. If it works for her, I don't see how it can't work for others. But you do have to figure it out for yourself. And for the record, Buddha is not a yoga "deity" of any kind if that is helpful to you. I would hate to see someone miss out on the benefits of yoga for what to me is essentially semantics. Good luck in your search! | |
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| alright, so, here it is.
yoga and christianity are compatible.
yoga is a spiritual discipline just like prayer, meditation, group worship, rituals. these disciplines help us embrace and experience the Divine (however one would define that). no one religion 'corners the market' on disciplines, though different religions 'specialize' in specific disciplines--such as christianity cornerstoning on prayer, buddhism cornerstoning on meditation, etc. but, these religions do not say that one cannot practice other spiritual disciplines within their context--many christians practice meditation, ritual, group worship, etc--and many other religions practice multiple disciplines as well.
thus, you can add yoga to your spiritual disciplines, if you like. | |
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| Don't throw the baby out with the bath water.
I'm a Christian (my husband's a pastor) and my faith is the most important part of my life. And yes, I believe Jesus Christ is the only route to salvation.
That being said, yoga has seriously helped me understand things about myself my Christian upbringing and current ownership of my Christian faith never really exposed. That's not to say they're contradictory! To practice "true" yoga you probably would be at conflict with your Christian faith. But to practice yoga asanas and to benefit from meditation you do not have to embrace the religious tenents of the Hindu faith. The eastern world has reached a much higher understanding of the human body and mind than the west has. Yoga has taught me so much about how God has created me. I am fully convinced that when we die someday and finally learn the truth of all things, we will be amazed at the complexity and inter-connectedness of God's creation, primarily the human body and spirit. There is so much potential for better health through yoga than ignoring our mind-body connection. I struggled for a while with even doing "sun salutations" (gasp - am I WORSHIPPING the sun?!) or even saying "namaste" at the end of class and bowing. But I think people who run away, afraid they are doing some sort of evil "magic" are those who have not found security in their own faith in God. God can not be hurt by idols and we are not offending God if we do not put any stock in them. It is when we think these idols hold power that counters God's power that we are actually acting blasphemously. But when we discard these idols as just that - false idols - we are essentially saying they are not powerful because they are nothing.
I'm probably going to get blasted for this post  but I get really, really, really peeved when Christians knock yoga. It is just SO ignorant and feeble. | |
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| Yoga is not religion. There's a very short booklet oddly enough called, "Difference Between Religion and Yoga" written by The Mother (who continues Sri Aurobindo's work after he left the physical body). Sixty pages and $3.00 so there's no excuse:-) It is well presented and makes a very good catalyst for thought.
I do not understand the presence of Hindu deities in a yoga asana classroom. In some cases it reflects the beliefs of the owners. In other cases it is simply mis-knowledge and mis-perception and thus mis-decorating.
One of the things people fail to realize is that Divinity is all things. It is not just wellness but it is disease. it is not just the beautiful river but the trashy gutter of a city street. Moses, Buddha, Mohammed, Jesus, there is no copright on divinity, no trademark, no ownership. Those are the things of human mind not divine spirit.
We better worship the sun, and the oxygen, and the water, and the food because with our current practices we surely aren't going to have them much longer. Haven't we been disconnected long enough and it's the definition of insanity still "doing the same thing over and over again and expecting the result to be different"?
Yoga practice is a pathway to connecting with your soul, the self. If your religion (whatever it may be)facilitates that progress, and that progress has been evidenced over your years, and you are a more connected, more compassionate, more relating human being than you were when you started, then rock on with your bad self. If not then it's more than pertinent to ask, "when am I going to get it" and "will yoga help me get it", not around my beliefs but THROUGH them.
Jesus is a mind-state which is completely supported by the vast body of wisdom known as Yoga. The divine has many messengers and we are all mailboxes. Some of us only check the box once a month, other never at all. Yoga puts you IN the mailbox.
But if it freaks you out then you shouldn't do it. It is better to live happily under a rock than to live miserably under the wing of divinity.
Edited by purnayoga 2007-04-12 7:41 PM
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 8442
| joanna - I hope you don't get blasted, but just incase, I am going to give you a big CHEER first!!!!
Hurray!!!!!!!!!!  | |
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| I think it says some place in the bible that by their works you shall know them. Think about the people that are in your current yoga studio, and how yoga impacts their lives. If you think it's a positive improvement, then continuing doing it. If not, stop.
For the record buddha was not a god, and never claimed to be, therefore any representations of him are no more idols than statues of JFK, Einstein, or the pope. | |
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| The Christians I talk to (or talk "at" usually) who can't figure out how I can do yoga and be true to my faith always point out that doing yoga is "dangerous." This is where the idol comment fits in. They think by practicing yoga asanas you are participating in some sort of pagan ritual which will open the doors to the occult (seriously). That you are opening yourself up to demonic influence. They are, essentially, afraid of the Hindu religion because they think it and all its symbolism and ritual is POWERFUL. I point to passages in the New Testament by Paul which talk about eating the food used in idol worship - the food is not dangerous or you are not evil because you eat it - the idols hold no power because they are not real. The food used in these sacrifices is perfectly good nutrition! Paul warns against the appearance of participation in the idol-worship, not the actual eating of the meat. He never says it is wrong, however. He just says to be careful that you are not striving to fit into the world and that others will not be able to distinguish you, a child of God, from the "pagans". Yoga is actually a wonderful practice in that we Christians can learn the wisdom that these "pagans" have to offer us (the food in the idol sacrifices had nutrional value) without being Hindus ourselves (you draw your own line by examining your motivations - are you trying to "fit in" with your class by bowing and saying "namaste" or have you finally come to understand the benefit of that salutation and asana without attachment to how others see you?). Hope this made sense. | |
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| I love these threads. They seem to pop-up on this forum from time to time. Some get quite lengthy and heated. It's fascinating how people reconcile their cultural beliefs with their intuition.
As laylie99 pointed out, the answer may be in your question. Why are you not completely at peace with yourself? What is it about Yoga that has led you to this question? | |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 5098
Location: Somewhere in the Mountains of Western NC | Hey Grasshopper, You should mosey over to the philosophy section and you will find several hundred pages of this very topic. It's quite interesting to say the least over there. Have fun reading all of it. I'm going to take a bow on this thread because I'm still pooped out from this discussion 2 years ago,  Whoever said that about Hindu dieties.....there is a place for everything and if you're going to worship Ganesh, a yoga room is certainly a good place to have his statue. My personal favorite diety is Devi Durga. I've always liked her riding that Tiger...she gives me so much motivation and strength, | |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 2479
Location: A Blue State | This thread is in the wrong forum, and, as Cyndi-ji points out, it is a topic that we have discussed at great length. If you take yoga as it is described in the ancient texts, like the Gita and the Yoga Sutras, then you are led to understand that Man can approach God by introspection, self discipline, and practice. If you take Christianity as described by its fundamentalist proponents, the one and only path to God is through our Saviour, Jesus Christ. So you have an unignorable contradiction in bringing the two together. If, on the other hand, you take Hatha Yoga's physical aspects in isolation of the underlying philosophy, you have nothing to fear as a Christian "practicing yoga". You might, however, encounter folks who would tell you that you are not actually practicing yoga. And so the debate would continue. So far as statues of deities in the yoga studio, I can't really see why Buddha would be there -- maybe as a inspiration to meditation. It's quite obvious why Siva might be there -- as the author of yoga -- and Ganesha certain has a place, given that some say he is a greater yogi that his father, and since he in any event should be acknowledged at the start. Om Sri Ganeshaya namah, .. bg | |
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| Today, I shall tell you one funny and true thing.
When the great Jesus Christ lived, around 2006 years ago, Yoga was already few thousand years old.
I am sure that either a) Jesus did know Yoga as he was All knowing. OR b) He did not know Yoga and he was NOT all knowing.
I want to assume the first as true. As the second assumption defies this thread.
Assuming the first one: Jesus never said anything Against Yoga. | |
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| Well said. This more or less sums up the experience I recently had on my yoga retreat in Egypt. You have coalesced things nicely for me, thanks.
Fee
purnayoga - 2007-04-13 12:38 AM
Yoga is not religion. There's a very short booklet oddly enough called, "Difference Between Religion and Yoga" written by The Mother (who continues Sri Aurobindo's work after he left the physical body). Sixty pages and $3.00 so there's no excuse:-) It is well presented and makes a very good catalyst for thought.
I do not understand the presence of Hindu deities in a yoga asana classroom. In some cases it reflects the beliefs of the owners. In other cases it is simply mis-knowledge and mis-perception and thus mis-decorating.
One of the things people fail to realize is that Divinity is all things. It is not just wellness but it is disease. it is not just the beautiful river but the trashy gutter of a city street. Moses, Buddha, Mohammed, Jesus, there is no copright on divinity, no trademark, no ownership. Those are the things of human mind not divine spirit.
We better worship the sun, and the oxygen, and the water, and the food because with our current practices we surely aren't going to have them much longer. Haven't we been disconnected long enough and it's the definition of insanity still "doing the same thing over and over again and expecting the result to be different"?
Yoga practice is a pathway to connecting with your soul, the self. If your religion (whatever it may be)facilitates that progress, and that progress has been evidenced over your years, and you are a more connected, more compassionate, more relating human being than you were when you started, then rock on with your bad self. If not then it's more than pertinent to ask, "when am I going to get it" and "will yoga help me get it", not around my beliefs but THROUGH them.
Jesus is a mind-state which is completely supported by the vast body of wisdom known as Yoga. The divine has many messengers and we are all mailboxes. Some of us only check the box once a month, other never at all. Yoga puts you IN the mailbox.
But if it freaks you out then you shouldn't do it. It is better to live happily under a rock than to live miserably under the wing of divinity.
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| sark - 2007-04-13 12:51 AM
I have just started yoga as a way to be more at peace with myself. However I am a devout Christian.
Hi ken,
I'm curious about the above statement. Why do you feel you need to go outside of your religion to find peace?
In his summary of the law, Jesus tells us to love the Lord our God with all our heart, all our soul, all our mind and all our strength and to love our neighbour as ourselves. There is no other commandment greater than these.
In my experience, if I focus on achieving this, everything else seems Irrelevant.
Jonathon | |
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Do you know about Centering Prayer?
It's Christian contemplative meditation. If you search for yoga on that site, you will get several hits; a number of centering parayer groups sponsor yoga sessions as a suggested training for centering prayer.
The only place in the Bible that quotes Christ being very specific about what criteria you will be used in final judgment is in Matthew 25:31-46. It's all about compassion for others, not how you meditate or which tradition's stories are most accurate. | |
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| Hi Ken,
Welcome!
Genesis 2:7
the LORD God formed the man from the dust of the ground and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man became a living being.
A search of each major religion's writings for the word "breath" will provide very valuable insight and point to the mysterious connection which we may each explore personally. How can the creature ever know the Creator? Is it possible to experience our living being-ness beyond the mind's knowledge? What are the fruits seen in those who travel this path? Thank you for your questions and search. God speed.
Michael
Edited by dmbones 2007-04-13 10:55 AM
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| Thank you for all the replies. They have helped ease my mind. To answer some of the points brought up:
-Why do I go outside Christianity to find peace? I have generalized anxiety where I tend to worry all the time. Praying to God does bring me great peace, as does attending church. However you need to help yourself, you cannot just pray to God everytime you have problems and expect a miraculous cure(even though it does happen). You need to use what is available to you. I use prayer time with God,relaxation techniques, meditation(Lectio Divina), and yoga. To say this has brought me immense relief is an understatement. I could have used western medicine and gone on medication(which may or may not have worked) or I could use eastern techniques such as yoga. I tried yoga first and see benefits after only 5 weeks. If after 5 weeks I am seeing such benefits, what will I be like incorporating it and the other things I do into my lifestyle?
-about centering prayer- yes, I do that most days. I have always heard it called Lectio Divina and it does bring me great relaxation and understanding of God's word.
What I have been asking myself is would I hesitate to eat in an Indian,Chinese,Thai, etc resteraunt with statues in there and food prepared by Hindu's,Buddhists,etc? No, would not even think about it
Would I go to India and practice yoga in a Hindu temple and try to seek enlightenment? No, would not do that
Would I practice yoga here as a form to relax the mind and body and find inner peace and a greater understanding of my body? Looks that way. When I am doing a sun salutation, I know I am not worshipping the sun, as all it is is a big ball of gas, no different than a stone I might pick up, both are God's creation and everything must be respected and revered.
2 commandments are at issue
1. Do not worship any other Gods - I am not doing that
2. Do not make any idols or bow to them - I am not doing that either.
Thanks for the replies and letting me work thru this and air out my thoughts. Even saying nanaste does not bother me now, basically a greeting. People say aloha all the time and no one gets worked up about that. | |
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| We must always consider the accuracy of something that originates from experience and is then translated by intellect. | |
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| if you've got the bible online do a word search for craven images
there are a lot of rules in there
and
if you really wanna be serious about your 'Christianity' go to the foundation books of it all
read
The Tanach---the Stone version is very good
the Talmud
and a lot more than the 'modern' translations of what people have been led to believe is the authoritative version of salvation.
When you get your spiritual knowledge second hand, that is, taking someone else's word for it, it's like drinking water down stream from a herd of cattle.
Get your knowledge from the source, it's cleaner, like drinking water from the original spring.
No amount of second hand learning will substitute for drinking the life giving waters of the fountainhead.
hopefully you thirst for knowing, and are not simply satisfied with believing and holding onto your faith.
let your faith be exposed to what is out there, if your faith is real, then, it will become stronger, otherwise you'll have your work cut out for you.
Good luck. | |
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Veteran
Posts: 101
| There are more similarities in today's world religions (to which I include, for simplicity, Buddhism), than their leaders are willing to admit. Remember that those are mainly institutions in which, as with all big organisations, the quest for power is predominant.
Those institutions are not important. You are.
True belief rests within your own Heart. Examine your Heart. It knows the Truth.
If you are truthful to your own Heart, Christ won't bother about the Buddha in your Yoga classroom a single bit. You can trust me on that one. Being a Christian, you might examine your true motives for doing Yoga, though.
What was it again that Christ said about your physical body? And what is meditation? I see an important analogy in Christ's teachings...
So yes, the 2 are certainly compatible, but don't just jump any bandwagon that comes along (don't do spiritual window shopping).
Tw | |
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Member
Posts: 28
| purnayoga - 2007-04-14 6:38 PM
Yoga is not religion. There's a very short booklet oddly enough called, "Difference Between Religion and Yoga" written by The Mother (who continues Sri Aurobindo's work after he left the physical body).
I consider myself a devout Christian and my Christian life is a form of yoga. I am currently reading Aurobindo's The Synthesis of Yoga adn see a great deal of Christian flavor. It is very incarnational, resurrectional. The whole thing about spirit transforming the material universe. I guess some people like myself see and appreciate the unifying truth beneath divergent expresions and others can only focus on the divergency.
www.sriaurobindoashram.info/
I also am very attracted to ther writings of Bede Griffiths, a Catholic sannysin who worked very hard to reconcile East and West spirituality.
http://www.bedegriffiths.com/
Edited by Shakuhachi 2008-06-15 2:44 PM
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| Going back to the root OP,
This book might help:
The Second Coming Of Christ.
The Resurrection of the Christ Within You.
By Paramahansa Yogananda.
ISBN: 0-87612-555-0
Yogananda was give a divine mission by Babji through his guru Swami Sri Yukteswar.
To right a Commentary on The New Testament, and the Bhagavad Gita, to create a synthesis between yoga and Christianity.
He turns the bible into an esoteric approach to Christianity.
These two books, well in fact there's four books in all, are some of the most influential books I've read.
Hope you can get your hands on them.
Phil | |
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| Yoga and Christianity are totally compatible and Yoga and Christianity are totally incompatible! It all depends on your Yoga and on your Christianity. It depends on your level of dogmatic thinking as opposed your ability to see the bigger picture in both, seeing the substance as opposed to seeing the form. Finding the meaning as opposed to slavishly following the words.
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| Due to re-opening of this thread again. I wish to add one more thing to my previous posting on it. And, extend the same.
I am reposting the whole again.
--------------------------------------------
Today, I shall tell you one funny and true thing.
When the great Jesus Christ lived, around 2006 years ago, Yoga was already few thousand years old.
I am sure that either a) Jesus did know Yoga as he was All knowing. OR b) He did not know Yoga and he was NOT all knowing.
I want to assume the first as true. As the second assumption defies this thread.
Assuming the first one: Jesus never said anything Against Yoga
(Addition) Therefore, you need to find
a) who is that telling you about Yoga and Christianity.
b) And, also, you need know whether Yoga is Anti Christianity or Christianity is AntiYoga.
c) And, you shall definitely find, the former is IMPOSSIBLE. Whereas the second is possible only when other persons than Jesus talk about Yoga. | |
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| Jesus did not write the New Testament and a lot of it was written by people who did not even know Jesus (i.e. Paul). Those who did know Jesus wrote many years after his death. It is improbable that all of them could read or write, so someone else wrote it for them. All that being true, and adding to that the fact that translations are also interpretations, and the early Church edited out a lot and changed other things to fit their vision, any word exact reading of the New Testament is not going to be the literal "word of Jesus." I have read bible passages in English and German translations and they do not have the same meaning. I am fluent in two closely related languages and therefore know that translating exact meaning is impossible. How difficult must it be to translate un-related languages, centuries apart and keep the content the same as well as understandable!
We do not have transcripts of everything that Jesus said, so it is possible that Jesus did know about and mention Yoga. I don't think that it really matters. If Yoga is working for you, continue to do it! If Christianity (or Hinduism, or Judaism, or Buddhism, or Islam, or Agnosticism, or Atheism) is working for you, continue to do it also!
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| zeitgeist
http://zeitgeistmovie.com/main.htm
let's all get real
we don't know anything about any Religious figure, we believe, we don't know | |
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Veteran
Posts: 101
| Right on, Steve
Tw | |
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| Some of the things were astonishing to me. I wondered whether an average American has intelligence to be a Democrat.
SCThornley - 2008-06-25 8:43 PM
zeitgeist
http://zeitgeistmovie.com/main.htm
let's all get real
we don't know anything about any Religious figure, we believe, we don't know | |
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| kulkarnn - 2008-06-26 8:54 AM
Some of the things were astonishing to me. I wondered whether an average American has intelligence to be a Democrat.
SCThornley - 2008-06-25 8:43 PM
zeitgeist
http://zeitgeistmovie.com/main.htm
let's all get real
we don't know anything about any Religious figure, we believe, we don't know
It doesn't matter, the democrats were going to end the war before they swept into congress (house and senate) and now it's business as usual
power corrupts
absolute power corrupts absolutely
the only thing we can do as individuals is stop believing the dogma and think for ourselves and judge for ourselves and KNOW and no longer believe
No one is above the most lowly among us nor are either exempt from judgment, HERE, NOW, among us.
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| tweeva - 2008-06-26 4:09 AM
Right on, Steve
Tw
gee whiz, thanks | |
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| Hey Jim,
If you want a Testament written by someone who Knew Christ personally and was around at the time and understood an esoteric interpretation of his saying? Try getting hold of a copy of:
The Gospel of Saint Thomas.
I'm not expecting any belief in any testament. Just seeing if there's anything relevant to the human condition.
jimg - 2008-06-26 12:31 AM
Jesus did not write the New Testament and a lot of it was written by people who did not even know Jesus (i.e. Paul). Those who did know Jesus wrote many years after his death. It is improbable that all of them could read or write, so someone else wrote it for them. All that being true, and adding to that the fact that translations are also interpretations, and the early Church edited out a lot and changed other things to fit their vision, any word exact reading of the New Testament is not going to be the literal "word of Jesus." I have read bible passages in English and German translations and they do not have the same meaning. I am fluent in two closely related languages and therefore know that translating exact meaning is impossible. How difficult must it be to translate un-related languages, centuries apart and keep the content the same as well as understandable!
We do not have transcripts of everything that Jesus said, so it is possible that Jesus did know about and mention Yoga. I don't think that it really matters. If Yoga is working for you, continue to do it! If Christianity (or Hinduism, or Judaism, or Buddhism, or Islam, or Agnosticism, or Atheism) is working for you, continue to do it also!
Edited by Phil 2008-06-26 10:42 AM
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 2479
Location: A Blue State |
Yoga and Christianity.... reminds me of the comment about a Fish without a Bicycle.
But have you been following the parade of silver car stick-on fish thingies: first we had the fish with little feet...and now the one that has letters inside saying "N Chips".
... bg | |
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| I personally know yoga teachers who use teach in Quaker meetings and Unitarian and Presbyterian churches. At the same time, people like Pat Robertson say that yoga's evil. So, ultimately, it depends on what kind of devout Christian you are.
For a fundamentalist who believes that anything "spiritual" that doesn't point directly to Jesus and only to Jesus is Satanic...well, yoga's probably not for you.
On the other hand, one whose version of Christianity is a bit more open and/or ecumenical, can be one of the millions of Christians doing yoga.
For those somewhere in between, I've seen links to "Christian yoga" websites, which apparently mix asanas with Christian theology.
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 2479
Location: A Blue State | Well, ok. But I always come back to wondering whether literatist christianity can accept anything with elements of another belief system. What would Jesus do... in a yoga class?
... bg | |
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| Dear Dr. Ajay: I bow down to you. Your statement below is well stated that I can only comment in praise. Thanks very much. The problem with those who call Yoga evil with their Christ association is that they think: Christ is a human body form, which of course it was, but it is NOT anything beyond. That is why any other body form can not be Jesus. I mean they think that there was only one body in which Son of God came, and that was Jesus Christ Body. So, if anyone else believes in any other Body or anybody else, then they are evil. The fact is that a) No body is evil whether they believe in any body or anybody or nobody, until they do harm to others. As a matter of fact, many times those who believe in one body only harm others, as you can see from the history, making them evil. b) Everybody is Jesus if they can understand that they are NOT only body, but they have mind and spirit, and when they clean their mind, which is real Yoga, they know spirit, which is the real Jesus.
Namaste.
drjay1966 - 2008-09-13 2:28 PM
I personally know yoga teachers who use teach in Quaker meetings and Unitarian and Presbyterian churches. At the same time, people like Pat Robertson say that yoga's evil. So, ultimately, it depends on what kind of devout Christian you are.
For a fundamentalist who believes that anything "spiritual" that doesn't point directly to Jesus and only to Jesus is Satanic...well, yoga's probably not for you.
On the other hand, one whose version of Christianity is a bit more open and/or ecumenical, can be one of the millions of Christians doing yoga.
For those somewhere in between, I've seen links to "Christian yoga" websites, which apparently mix asanas with Christian theology.
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| Dear Dr. Ajay: I bow down to you. Your statement below is well stated that I can only comment in praise. Thanks very much. The problem with those who call Yoga evil with their Christ association is that they think: Christ is a human body form, which of course it was, but it is NOT anything beyond. That is why any other body form can not be Jesus. I mean they think that there was only one body in which Son of God came, and that was Jesus Christ Body. So, if anyone else believes in any other Body or anybody else, then they are evil. The fact is that a) No body is evil whether they believe in any body or anybody or nobody, until they do harm to others. As a matter of fact, many times those who believe in one body only harm others, as you can see from the history, making them evil. b) Everybody is Jesus if they can understand that they are NOT only body, but they have mind and spirit, and when they clean their mind, which is real Yoga, they know spirit, which is the real Jesus.
Namaste.
drjay1966 - 2008-09-13 2:28 PM
I personally know yoga teachers who use teach in Quaker meetings and Unitarian and Presbyterian churches. At the same time, people like Pat Robertson say that yoga's evil. So, ultimately, it depends on what kind of devout Christian you are.
For a fundamentalist who believes that anything "spiritual" that doesn't point directly to Jesus and only to Jesus is Satanic...well, yoga's probably not for you.
On the other hand, one whose version of Christianity is a bit more open and/or ecumenical, can be one of the millions of Christians doing yoga.
For those somewhere in between, I've seen links to "Christian yoga" websites, which apparently mix asanas with Christian theology.
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| Neel,
While what you are saying is great and I totally agree, the problem is that the Christian, Muslim and Jewish religions do NOT allow for any deviation of belief. You MUST believe that Christ (Father/Son/Holy Spirit) is the one and only god and that the entire "truth" is in the Bible or you are not a Christian. You MUST believe that Jehovah (the God of the Old Testament) is the one and only god and the entire "truth" is in the Old Testament or you are not a Jew (religion, not race). You MUST believe that Allah is the one and only god, Mohammad is his prophet and the entire "truth" is in the Koran to be a Muslim. These are all exclusive religions/beliefs and they all preach that eternal damnation is what you get if you believe or practice anything else. This makes it very difficult for the more fundamentalist or dogmatic types from each of these religions to embrace something like yoga which is outside their belief structure and therefore subject to eternal damnation. You say that a person is good or evil by their actions (and I agree), but the Bible/Western tradition says that you are good or evil based on your beliefs first. Pat Robertson and many other American Christian preachers preach on a regular basis that yoga is a false religion and is evil.
You are coming at this from a Hindu/Eastern perspective where there are many paths. The basic Jewish/Christian/Muslim/Western perspective (although there have always been more open minds) is that there is only one correct belief and only one path. You say that "everybody is Jesus". This is a Buddhist type concept like everybody is a/the Buddha. This concept is blasphemy for a Christian as Christ is thought of as being something totally different (God) than people (man). The Christian goal is to follow Christ ("like a lamb follows the shephard"), NOT to realize that you are Christ or become Christ.
What does this have to do with those of us who teach yoga? I think that we need to be sensitive to where our students are coming from and teach classes that work for all of them. That does not mean teaching differently, but rather choosing words (as well as poses) that work for the people in the class. I believe that as teachers we should be inclusive and try not alienate anyone, while staying true to what it is that we teach. We accommodate people with physical disabilities whenever possible and we need to accommodate people with mental/belief disabilities as well. If we believe that yoga will open the mind and the body of the practitioner, we need to understand that we need to start where each student is and go from there. We also need to trust that yoga will work; maybe not as we see it, but it will work in a unique way for each unique person. As each individual gets more in touch with their mind/body/energy, transformation happens. Our job as teachers is not to try to replace one belief system with another; our job is to give the students the tools they need to transform themselves; from the inside out.
Jim
Edited by jimg 2008-09-16 2:24 PM
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| I like that. | |
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Expert Yogi
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| I like that, too. I will add though, and I always hesitate to get into this stuff, that not all Christians believe that the one and only complete truth is in the Bible. The fundamentalists - yes. In other places, cooler heads prevail. | |
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Expert Yogi
Posts: 2479
Location: A Blue State | I guess it's it's kind of pointless to try to talk rationally about things that are fundamentally irrational. Either you agree or you don't....
.. besides, god lives in the plants in my yard. He talks to me while I am not paying attention, and evades me most of the time when I look to carefully for him.
... bg
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| nice one bj,i like the word 'irrational'.Religion is not in the way it has to be,it's been misinterpretated and being religious is forgotten is by the world.existence is the greatest gift and yoga helps in makin our existence meaningful.
Really doesn't matter which religion we belong to,it is how we live our life to the fullest.
It's about choices,it really hard to say,it has to be experienced.yoga is truth and it is has to experienced.
just to share one information..CROSS is sacred in christianity,horizontal line refers to time and the vertical line refers to consciousness,i.e,awareness,
-----Book of understanding by Osho.
and yoga is a path for awareness
Edited by yogiJ 2008-09-23 4:10 AM
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| That is true only if one's whatever accepted religion and the underlying logic allows one to live the life to fullest. For example, I have a friend who recently rented a room from another close friend of mine. Now, these two individuals are very very good, because both of them give me fantastic food treats! One is Islamic and another Hindu. The Hindu friend of mine rented a room from the Islamic lady that I know and who is a good person. But, just before moving in, she told my Hindu friend that he is NOT allowed any pictures, including his own wife's picture on the walls of the room. Now, he feels that he can not live his life to the fullest without his wife's picture!
yogiJ - 2008-09-23 4:00 AM
Really doesn't matter which religion we belong to,it is how we live our life to the fullest.
It's about choices,it really hard to say,it has to be experienced.yoga is truth and it is has to experienced.
just to share one information..CROSS is sacred in christianity,horizontal line refers to time and the vertical line refers to consciousness,i.e,awareness,
-----Book of understanding by Osho.
and yoga is a path for awareness | |
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| There were some misunderstandings before. Prresently, even the Catholic priests practise Yoga meditation.
What makes your meditation Christian is your Christian faith.
The promoters of Christain meditation were Father late John Main and Father
Laurence Freeman.
On Sunday 30-Nov-08 there was even a TV show (Canada TeleLatino Channel)
in which Fr. Laurence Freeman demonstrated Christian meditation.
You find the basis of it on:
http://www.wccm.org/faqslist.asp?pagestyle=faqlist
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| Actually there is official approval of Christian meditation by the Pope John Paul II, Congregation of the Doctrine of the Faith, headed by the present Pope: Letter to the bishops of the Catholic church on same aspects of Christian meditation.
It is a long document, which needs thorough study. It seems that there are some subtle differences between Christian and Yoga meditation.
http://www.ewtn.com/library/curia/cdfmed.htm
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| sagopalm - 2008-12-06 9:51 PM
Actually there is official approval of Christian meditation by the Pope John Paul II, Congregation of the Doctrine of the Faith, headed by the present Pope: Letter to the bishops of the Catholic church on same aspects of Christian meditation.
It is a long document, which needs thorough study. It seems that there are some subtle differences between Christian and Yoga meditation.
http://www.ewtn.com/library/curia/cdfmed.htm
It comes down to what your intention is. If you are trying to acheive your own salvation through a technique, that is more of a taboo yoga practice. If you are doing the same thing but to calm yourself and make yourself more present and availible to God so that Christ may work in you, that is ok.
Another significant difference is the unity/diversity doctrine. Christianity teaches ultimate diversity, yoga pretty much a unity. Talk of an ultimate unity with God is pretty much Christian heresy. But not the way I understand it. I do not speak of it in my Catholic Christian circle but I am more advaita. Bede Griffiths has helped me on that to see that it is not either/or but both/and. I think that was an important aspect of what Jesus taught but it ran countercultural to the Hebrew concept of God.
My problem is that I have a much more eastern unitive world view but at the same time I love the Church rituals. In Catholic circles I am considered on the edge if not totally heterodox. I love Christ and accept him as my savior but I understand him from a yoga perspective, a manifestation of God like all of us except that he clearly knew it through and through. Most of us catch only a glimps now and then. | |
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| I know this thread is old but I read it all, very interesting but the poster (I'm sorry I don't know your name) "purnayoga" mentioned the booklet "Difference Between Religion and Yoga" written by The Mother.
I've googled it and can't find any place I can buy it. Can anyone help me with this?
Thank you.
susan | |
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Member
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| pixiesusan - 2009-03-21 6:38 AM
I know this thread is old but I read it all, very interesting but the poster (I'm sorry I don't know your name) "purnayoga" mentioned the booklet "Difference Between Religion and Yoga" written by The Mother.
I've googled it and can't find any place I can buy it. Can anyone help me with this?
Thank you.
susan
if anywhere I thought you would find it here:
http://www.infobuddhism.com/infobuddhism/institute%20for%20wholistic%20education/design/mother.html
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| u MIGHT also check out thomas merton, diarmuid o'murchu, matthew fox & russill paul
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| Try this * Difference Between Religion and Yoga A Compilation From the Talks and Writings of the Mother [Used]
http://www.bookfinder.com/search/?author=&title=Difference+Between+Religion+and+Yoga&lang=en&submit=Begin+search&new_used=*&destination=us¤cy=USD&mode=basic&st=sr&ac=qr | |
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| I am not so experienced to provide guidance or information here in fact i got too much info for my personal use. Thank you all guys for sharing such a nice information. | |
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Member
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Location: nairobi, kenya. | there are hindu yogis who believe that, at some point in his life, jesus christ travelled to india... | |
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| I wonder what language he would have spoken in India?
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Member
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| Simply stated, yoga can be used as a tool to better know your personal spirituality, regardless of dogma. Think of it as fuel you put in your spiritual car. We all drive different models of cars, but they all need fuel.
Steve
Yoga Learning Center - Yoga Online | |
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Member
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Location: nairobi, kenya. | l'm no expert on the subject but also believe that in search for universal consciousness/self-realization, the less said the better... | |
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| I think it is a place in the bible that by their works you shall know them. If you think it's a positive improvement, then continuing doing it. If not, stop. Think about the people that are in your current yoga studio, and how yoga impacts their lives.
For the record buddha was not a god, and never claimed to be, therefore any representations of him are no more idols than statues of the pope. | |
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New User
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| Hi,
Many people today (including some Christians) are taking up yoga practice. We'll later consider whether yoga philosophy can truly be separated from yoga practice, but we must first establish that there are crucial doctrinal differences between yoga and Christianity. Let's briefly look at just a few of these.
Yoga and Christianity have very different concepts of God. As previously stated, the goal of yoga is to experience union with "God." But what do yogis mean when they speak of "God," or Brahman? Exactly what are we being encouraged to "unite" with? Most yogis conceive of "God" as an impersonal, spiritual substance, coextensive with all of reality. This doctrine is called pantheism, the view that everything is "God." It differs markedly from the theism of biblical Christianity. In the Bible, God reveals Himself as the personal Creator of the universe. God is the Creator; the universe, His creation. The Bible maintains a careful distinction between the two.
A second difference between yoga and Christianity concerns their views of man. Since yoga philosophy teaches that everything is "God," it necessarily follows that man, too, is "God." Christianity, however, makes a clear distinction between God and man. God is the Creator; man is one of His creatures. Of course man is certainly unique, for unlike the animals he was created in the image of God. Nevertheless, Christianity clearly differs from yoga in its unqualified insistence that God and man are distinct.
Thank you.
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| I heard that Christianity disapproved of yoga as a lifestyle, but I don't care actually... I exercise it anyway.
Edited by Elizabeth_I 2011-05-16 5:23 AM
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| I would like to mention here there is nothing Christian or Hindu or any other religion about yoga.. just like gym.. you work out. you get fit.
Ashwin
www.artofliving.org/what-is-yoga | |
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| Dictionary definition of YOGA:
1capitalized : a Hindu theistic philosophy teaching the suppression of all activity of body, mind, and will in order that the self may realize its distinction from them and attain liberation
2: a system of exercises for attaining bodily or mental control and well-being
Whatever your linguistic source, Yoga (capital Y) is a part of Hinduism and the Hindu scriptures Bhagavad Gita etc. It is in fundamental conflict with the Jewish, Christian and Islamic faiths. On the other hand, yoga (as in asana, pranayama and to a certain extent meditation) is a system of physical and mental exercises devoid of any philosophy or religion. The Yoga Sutras are a religious text and have absolutely nothing to do with postural yoga. The Hindu philosophical and religious part of Yoga is often combined with New Age philosophies and other influences which are then assumed to be part of the yoga exercise part. They are actually separated by many centuries and are philosophically opposed to each other. Yoga in the Yoga Sutras is against activity of the mind and body. The word "asana" as used in the YS literally means "seat", as in sitting in meditation, not any kind of exercise or stretching.
Physical and mental exercises commonly called yoga (lower case y) today were developed in the early 1900's and are only related to Hinduism in that they were mainly developed by people that happened to be Hindu. Is baseball "Christian" because it was started by Christians and mainly played by Christians?
If you are actually interested in where modern postural yoga comes from, please read "Yoga Body" by Mark Singleton, or at least check it out on amazon.com or somewhere.
You can do yoga no matter what your religion or philosophies, just like you don't need to be a Taoist or Confucianist to practice tai chi. Once you start getting into Yoga philosophy, you start getting into Hindu religion and philosophy, as they are the same (except for the New Age additions to Hindu philosophy commonly considered part of Yoga philosophy).
Edited by jpg 2011-06-22 2:42 PM
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Yoga and Christianity